@ruantec C# course

[PCXL-Fan]

Sounds good @ruantec. I'll join up again.

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[SCHUMI_4EVER]

By the way, the homework should not be the exact same as the lesson. For instance there was a lesson where you taught us how to add numbers I think it was. Well what I did afterwards is I went and tried to get the program to also subtract, divide and multiply because only by experimenting on your own can you really learn and remember. So the homework should always be something similar, but still something which is a little newer, perhaps with a hint or two to guide us along, like for instance telling us that a slash represent divide and an asterisk multiply.
I know this might get harder to do later on but at the start whilst we are still getting used to the syntax and the commands it's very important.
Another basic example is the Hello World program, instead of just telling us to create another program exactly like that what we also need to is make it say an additional line, or perhaps close after a certain time period (and then you could tell us the command for a delayed close as a hint).
Other than that though I thought your lessons were brilliant, especially the way you used colours and screenshots to make everything simpler (sure books also have those...but usually in black and white...which does make things a little harder to see).

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[@ruantec]

Originally Posted by SCHUMI_4EVER

By the way, the homework should not be the exact same as the lesson. For instance there was a lesson where you taught us how to add numbers I think it was. Well what I did afterwards is I went and tried to get the program to also subtract, divide and multiply because only by experimenting on your own can you really learn and remember. So the homework should always be something similar, but still something which is a little newer, perhaps with a hint or two to guide us along, like for instance telling us that a slash represent divide and an asterisk multiply.
I know this might get harder to do later on but at the start whilst we are still getting used to the syntax and the commands it's very important.
Another basic example is the Hello World program, instead of just telling us to create another program exactly like that what we also need to is make it say an additional line, or perhaps close after a certain time period (and then you could tell us the command for a delayed close as a hint).
Other than that though I thought your lessons were brilliant, especially the way you used colours and screenshots to make everything simpler (sure books also have those...but usually in black and white...which does make things a little harder to see).

Very nice ideas mate... {me taking notes } am going to keep that in mind.

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[S.T.A.R.S.]

Hey ruantec if I will ever need help with some C# things,may I feel free to ask you for your help?

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[@ruantec]

Originally Posted by S.T.A.R.S.

Hey ruantec if I will ever need help with some C# things,may I feel free to ask you for your help?

of course.. but not only you if someone else need/wants some help in anything just contact me or ask me

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[S.T.A.R.S.]

In that case I have a question about the Visual C#.

I noticed that MOST of the computers have .NET framework 1.0 installed.And in most cases applications made in Visual C# 2002 will work on MOST computers so the user won't need to install .NET framework 2.0 or higher version.Many today's graphic drivers automatically install .NET framework 1.1 so C# 2002 applications will work on most computers.I am saying this because there ARE users who hate to install the new .NET framework version.Anyway...I noticed that C# 2002 applications also have very small size and work a little bit faster then C# 2005 or C# 2008 applications.Let's take this for example:
You go to make the new Windows application.You create it,compile and save.The size of that application in Visual C# 2002,2003,2005 and 2008 is the following:

C# 2002(with .NET 1.0) - 6 KB
C# 2003(with .NET 1.1) - 20 KB
C# 2005(with .NET 2.0) - 20 KB
C# 2008(with .NET 3.5) - 8 KB

So here you see that version 2002 has the smallest size.Also I tested the speed of application execution that I made in Visual C# 2002 on weak computer and I got the following results together with other 3 C# versions:

C# 2002 application execution - works MUCH faster on slow computers
C# 2003 application execution - works PRETTY fast on slow computers
C# 2005 application execution - works a little bit SLOWER on slow
computers
C# 2008 application execution - works a little bit faster,(then C# 2005),on
slow computers

You see...I just don't know which version should I continue to use.For 3
years I was using C# 2005,but I saw many things that I liked in C# 2002.
Also the size of the .NET framework 1.0 package is 2-3 MB smaller for the difference of the .NET 1.1 and .NET 2.0.And especially from the .NET 3.0 and MORE ESPECIALLY from the .NET 3.5.This .NET package size is important to me considering that I must include the .NET framework package together with the application when the user wants to buy it.And as we all know,users hate big size...including me.
.NET framework versions's size:

.NET framework version 1.0 (C# 2002) - 20.8 MB
.NET framework version 1.1 (C# 2003) - 23.1 MB
.NET framework version 2.0 (C# 2005) - 22.4 MB
.NET framework version 3.0 (C# 2008) - 50.3 MB
.NET framework version 3.5 (C# 2008) - 186 MB

Ok I admit that the .NET framework version 3.5 has the most features,but it's size is just so big.The .NET framework version 3.0 is also great,but it's size isn't so small either.As for other 3 versions of the .NET framework,the size is more or less the same.But if you look EACH MB,the .NET 1.0 is the smallest.Ok I know that 99% of you will say that the .NET 1.0 is the worst and do not have so many new and nice features like .NET 2.0 has...and especially the .NET 3.0 and 3.5.

Ok...Visual C# 2002 with the .NET 1.0 is pretty old and probably just 1% of the C# programmers is using it.But I found so many advantages in it.
One big disadvantage that I don't like in C# 2002 is that the PROPERTIES window won't open after the debug if the OUTPUT window isn't opened all the time.(I am still hoping that there is some fix on the internet to solve this).

Every time when I ask ANY C# programmer which version of the C# they use,they all say "C# 2008".Ok...I like that version pretty much and all those new features are great,but then again I hate it because it's .NET framework version 3.0 or 3.5 doesn't support older operating systems and that is bad because I know many people who are still using operating systems like Windows ME and Windows 98 SE.

For already more then 3 weeks I am asking myself which version of the C# should I use...2002,2003,2005 or 2008...
I mean they are ALL good to me,but somehow the version 2002 left the biggest impression on me.Yeah I admit that there are many disadvantages in C# 2002 for the difference of C# 2005 or even C# 2008.C# 2002 and even C# 2003 do not have the option to play the WAV files directly from the application using the System.Media.SoundPlayer,but then again there are many ways on which you can play the file in C# 2002 and C# 2003.
Also when you start writing the code,the menu pops up immediately on the first letter typed in C# 2005 and C# 2008,for the difference of C# 2002 and C# 2003 where you need to write the first word without any help menu that pops up.For example.If I have the BUTTON control on the form called "button1",when you start typing "bu...",the menu automatically pops up in C# 2005 and 2008,but in C# 2002 and 2003 you must write "button1" and then write "." and ONLY then the menu pops up...not before.
Ok this is really not the reason why I would switch to the C# 2005 or 2008.It's not so hard to write the control name all by yourself lol.
Also the code view is colorful in C# 2005 and 2008 which helps you to find the part of the code that you need.In C# 2002 and 2003,EVERYTHING is black except the keywords which are in blue color.This might sound funny and stupid,but I like more when everything is the same color except for the keywords...lol.

I mean...if you program in C# 2005 or 2008,you can get use to that everything is much easier,but then when you go back to the C# 2002 or 2003,it's a little bit harder to find yourself considering that the version 2005 and 2008 did most of it automatically.

I know that the C# 2002 is already a dead programming language and 99% of the people is not using it anymore.(Honestly I don't know anyone who uses C# 2002 or even C# 2003).

So...considering all this advantages and disadvantages in all this 4 C# versions,which do you think it's the best to use in the future???

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[SCHUMI_4EVER]

erm...it would be best to PM such a question to @ruantec since it does not have much to do with the thread at hand and is personal...

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No$GBA DS FAQ 2.0

Get it right fools! The glass is HALF-EMPTY, not half-full!!!

!!! WARNING: Emulation requires a brain !!! WARNING: Emulation =/= Piracy !!!

[Squall-Leonhart]

.net 1.0 is OLD, SLOW, AND LIMITED.

Thats why it got left behind in favour of 2.0 so fast.

.NET framework version 3.0 (C# 2008) - 50.3 MB (Includes 2.0 and parts of 1.1)
.NET framework version 3.5 (C# 2008) - 186 MB (Includes 3.0 + SP, 2.0 + SP, and parts of 1.1)

Installing of 1.0 + SP3, 1.1 + SP1 and 3.5 SP1 will net you all versions of .net installed.

Also, for most people .net 1.0 isn't even installed. the minimum is 1.1 now.

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Last edited by Squall-Leonhart; June 5th, 2009 at 16:14. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

[@ruantec]

@ - S.T.A.R.S. after reading your huge post and trying to get your point about the different sizes etc.. i think am able to give you an answer but before that i have one question for you... why the hell do you need all those VS versions????

now to your question... for me the best one is VS 2008 with .net 3.5 SP1 wondering why?? the reason for that is because while coding @ES i´ve checked some stuff added in .net 3.5 SP1 where in most of the cases i got a huge speed gain in many areas so it seems like MS is indeed working to make this language the #1... if they will reach that goal well only the time will tell i think.

VS lower than 2005 are useless for me if you ask me.. most of the stuff were not really mature and because of that i even hated .net and C# in the past because after my first try with 2002 i just said WTF is that??? anyways things has changed and VS 2005 changed lots of stuff anyways the most advanced version is 2008 and that´s a fact.... it includes lots of fixes and changes that the very first version should have had at that time but that´s the life and things keep progressing with the time.

i myself am not caring much about old OS compatibilities because people keep moving and there are only few that still use those OS nowdays so why care??? only if necessary i would say. so again VS2008 is the way to go and if you need to reduce size there are few tools that allows compression and even encryption of your apps so that people can´t decompile them... if you want an example of a .net protected app download my pnach tool from the news thread and try to decompile .exe as you will notice there´s no way to get the code back

so forget all those older version and keep coding in VS2008(my opinion)

........... happy coding
@ruantec

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Last edited by @ruantec; June 5th, 2009 at 17:36.

[S.T.A.R.S.]

Damn I was afraid you were gonna say that lol ^.^

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[Hatorijr]

those who refuse to update .net, they only hurt themselves. if memory serves, some drivers now even rely on .net as supposedly nvidia started using .net in their drivers i once heard. and there are some programs that rely on .net as well. like i told @ruantec, if people who want to sue my apps do not want to update .net, than thats tough, they can just not use it period. those who refuse to update are also probably those who use illegal copies of windows who are unable to update their copies or are just to lazy to do so. than again i may be wrong but that was an excuse some have given me and i am almost certain you can get an installer from somewhere else for .net. yea it may be big, but look at the sp updates as well or some game updates that are even bigger.

but its better to code for at least .net 2.0 or higher, and as i mentioned to @ruantec once, when i find a good way to auto install the .net stuff i need for my apps, i will definitely put it into use one way or another so as to prevent people having to report a bug related to .net not being installed.

[S.T.A.R.S.]

LoL I don't know why,but I just love .NET 1.0 xD

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[@ruantec]

Originally Posted by S.T.A.R.S.

LoL I don't know why,but I just love .NET 1.0 xD

you love .net 1.0??? WTF!!!! mmmmm what can i do with you..{me thinking}...wait....i have a great idea

S.T.A.R.S. take that

        static void main()
        {
            if(S_T_A_R_S == using_Dot_Net1.0)
                kick_S_T_A_R_S_butt(true);
        }

        public void kick_S_T_A_R_S_butt(bool hard)
        {
            foreach (Legs PersonLeg in NorthAmerica)
            {
                PersonLeg.kickButt(S_T_A_R_S);
                if (hard)
                    repeat_ButtKick(100);
            }
        }

__________________

Current development tools:

Visual C++.net, Visual C#.net
Visual VB.net, Visual Webdeveloper.net
Bloodshed Dev C++, Borland C++
Visual Basic 6

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Last edited by @ruantec; June 5th, 2009 at 20:19.

[DarkSamus]

Originally Posted by @ruantec

        static void main()
        {
            if(S_T_A_R_S == using_Dot_Net1.0)
                kick_S_T_A_R_S_butt(true);
        }

        public void kick_S_T_A_R_S_butt(bool hard)
        {
            foreach (Legs PersonLeg in NorthAmerica)
            {
                PersonLeg.kickButt(S_T_A_R_S);
                if (hard)
                    repeat_ButtKick(100);
            }
        }

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Originally Posted by bobrocks95

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[ozzgx4]

I wouldn't mind joining up. It would be good to learn C#

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Originally Posted by snickothemule

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[SCHUMI_4EVER]

Originally Posted by Hatorijr

those who refuse to update .net, they only hurt themselves. if memory serves, some drivers now even rely on .net as supposedly nvidia started using .net in their drivers i once heard. and there are some programs that rely on .net as well. like i told @ruantec, if people who want to sue my apps do not want to update .net, than thats tough, they can just not use it period. those who refuse to update are also probably those who use illegal copies of windows who are unable to update their copies or are just to lazy to do so. than again i may be wrong but that was an excuse some have given me and i am almost certain you can get an installer from somewhere else for .net. yea it may be big, but look at the sp updates as well or some game updates that are even bigger.

but its better to code for at least .net 2.0 or higher, and as i mentioned to @ruantec once, when i find a good way to auto install the .net stuff i need for my apps, i will definitely put it into use one way or another so as to prevent people having to report a bug related to .net not being installed.

Not sure about nVidia as I had an ATI card around the the time of .NET 2.0 but it was ATI that used it in their Catalyst Control Center (the control panel for the card). I actually had to update .NET to update the drivers on my X850XT.

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No$GBA DS FAQ 2.0

Get it right fools! The glass is HALF-EMPTY, not half-full!!!

!!! WARNING: Emulation requires a brain !!! WARNING: Emulation =/= Piracy !!!

[Mad]

Originally Posted by @ruantec

i know my english isn´t the best but at least i tried to explain things as simple as possible... mmmm i think i´ll have to re-check my lessons and make a bit simplier.

Well the problem wasnt really you, but me!
I wasnt understanding most of the Logic part.

But the good thing is, it gave me more background info on how things (should)work, like the time i tried learning C++ by myself.

Now with java everything seems easier, its not like im seeing a bunch of code for the 1st time, it all fits now.

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[S.T.A.R.S.]

Originally Posted by @ruantec

        static void main()
        {
            if(S_T_A_R_S == using_Dot_Net1.0)
                kick_S_T_A_R_S_butt(true);
        }
 
        public void kick_S_T_A_R_S_butt(bool hard)
        {
            foreach (Legs PersonLeg in NorthAmerica)
            {
                PersonLeg.kickButt(S_T_A_R_S);
                if (hard)
                    repeat_ButtKick(100);
            }
        }

ROFLMAO this is the funniest sh!t ever!!! HAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!
GOOD ONE RUANTEC!!!!

Well here is one stupid question now...Anyone here uses .NET 1.0???
Or at least .NET 1.1???

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[Hatorijr]

i never used anything below .net 2.0, doubt i ever will either, 2.0 works for what i do so i have no need to go backwards lol.

[S.T.A.R.S.]

Originally Posted by Hatorijr

i never used anything below .net 2.0, doubt i ever will either, 2.0 works for what i do so i have no need to go backwards lol.

Well yeah I agree that the .NET 2.0 is great.But just for fun you could try .NET 1.1 and 1.0.I made many nice applications under the .NET 1.0.It's pretty good.

Hey ruantec let me ask you something.If I install SP3 for .NET 1.0 does that mean that I have some extra options in Visual Studio 2002 when writing the code or not?And what does this service packs actually change on .NET frameworks(any version)??Do they add some new features that you can use in code for applications???

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