Time for Linux thread #300

[Mako Eyes]

Alright, I've decided to give the penguin a chance. I actually always have since I tried Kubuntu out a while back one my friend's machine, but it just seems like a lot of work.

Anyway, I think I'll try it, but first I have a few questions.

First (and you're all no doubt sick of hearing this one), what distribution do you recommend? I'm near expecting the "It's all about personal preference" speech here, but lay me with what you got. I myself am considering either Ubuntu or Kubuntu, as they both seem popular, up-to-date, and easy to use. What do you suggest? Keep in mind that all I pretty much want the system for is browsing the Internet, listening to music, chatting, and schoolwork. I rarely game on my PC, and when I do it's either Doom or Quake or some emulator, of which I can grab Linux versions no problem.

Secondly: Partitioning. I'd like to dual-boot this with Windows XP. Am I able to create a partition for it upon installation or is third-party software involved? I once watched a friend partition the drive of my old computer using third-party software and it looked like a pain in the ass. Then again, I was young and software has matured much since. I just hope that, if it comes to this, I can find a decent free program (because I'm cheap lawlz) to do it. Of course, I'll be trying a live CD first to test things out, but if I like it I plan on installing it alongside Windows. Advice here is much welcomed.

Third: Device mounting and drivers. Basically: What needs to be done, how can it be done, and how hard is it to do? I have quite a bit of computer experience, but I have absolutely no Linux experience. I can probably practice this jazz using the live CD. That is, unless, doing so may cause problems. Also, how about setting up a network connection?

Fourth: Applications. Or, more specifically, application. I have an instant messenger (Gaim), browser (Firefox), and an office suite (Open Office, of course) lined up. However, a media player that suits my needs is a little harder to find. mPlayer and VLC are good and all, but I would like a dedicated music player with a simplified interface, global hotkey support, etc. In case you're wondering; yes, I am a foobar2000 enthusiast, and would like a program in sort of the same light. I'm looking into Rhythmbox, it seems to have what I'm looking for.

Alright, I guess that's all I have to ask right now. A number of you will probably suggest I "lurk moar" and look up Linux tutorials on the Internet somewhere. But I prefer an active discussion about it and in a forum that I've been going to for a while so I at least have an idea about who knows their stuff.

Thanks.

[Balthazard]

1# I would recommend Ubuntu or Suse (especially Suse)
I also Am a noob at linux But Suse whas really easy to use and had a lot of software installed aready for example my TV card whas already installed when I completed the instalation of SuSe and it came with a TV tuner software that I really liked.

2# You can make a partition next to your windows partition when you are installing linux BUT I know only try'd it with Suse and Ubuntu.

3# Dont know how to answer this quistion

4# software is really personal like you said you can use RythmBox.
Also sometimes there is also a linux port for windows program's.
Most of the distrutions come with more than 1 music player. And if that player doesn't suit you just search for one like you do with windows.

(about those linux tutorial they are way to long to read)

[chipsugar]

Mako Eyes:

1st. I like Mandriva. It has access to a lot of pre-configured software and automatically sets up most settings (hardware etc) correctly. Ubuntu and kubuntu are also good.

2nd. Most distributions should be fine with this as long at you've got unpartitioned space somewhere on the hard drive. If you have two hard disks then maybe put linux (and it's bootloader) on one and windows on the other. This means that should you upgrade either linux or windows (e.g. to Vista or another distro) you won't need to worry about not being able to start the other OS.

3rd. What hardware do you have? most graphics cards work fine (without 3d) out of the box. Nvidia and ATI have 3d linux drivers which are easy to install. Most other stuff *if* it works will work out of the box.

4th. Try Wine HQ to run your windows apps while you're searching.
It isn't the best way but with dual booting it will help until you find a linux equivalent.

[Mako Eyes]

Originally Posted by Balthazard

1# I would recommend Ubuntu or Suse (especially Suse)
I also Am a noob at linux But Suse whas really easy to use and had a lot of software installed aready for example my TV card whas already installed when I completed the instalation of SuSe and it came with a TV tuner software that I really liked.

Yea, I was looking into OpenSUSE. It looked very nice, but it requires 6 CDs (or one DVD) which I do not have on hand right now. I'm home from college on my mother's computer where the Internet is great, but she doesn't have a DVD recorder and I have only one CD left. I'll probably torrent the DVD version when I get back to college, even though it might take days to download because the connection there is so horrid. I'd like to try out a bunch of distributions.

Originally Posted by chipsugar

1st. I like Mandriva. It has access to a lot of pre-configured software and automatically sets up most settings (hardware etc) correctly. Ubuntu and kubuntu are also good.

I'll look into Mandriva. Perhaps that's what I'll use that last CD for. As for Ubuntu and Kubuntu, after messing around with live CDs and reading up on them I found out that they're just the same distribution running under different desktop environments and can be installed together (I had originally thought that Kubuntu was an updated version of Ubuntu, based on the original Ubuntu), so that narrows things down.

Originally Posted by chipsugar

3rd. What hardware do you have? most graphics cards work fine (without 3d) out of the box. Nvidia and ATI have 3d linux drivers which are easy to install. Most other stuff *if* it works will work out of the box.

Yea, I know about the ATi drivers, that's good. What about my Sound Blaster Audigy 2 and SATA hard drive? I'm not much worried about my networking card and whatnot, as that can probably run on standard drivers just fine. Also, my own computer has an Athlon64, so I'm considering installing a 64-bit distribution on it. Are there 64-bit Linux drivers available?

Originally Posted by chipsugar

4th. Try Wine HQ to run your windows apps while you're searching.
It isn't the best way but with dual booting it will help until you find a linux equivalent.

Thanks, I'll keep Wine HQ in mind. As stated above, I'm using an Athlon64, would this limit the programs I have available to me? I have never had the opportunity to switch to a 64-bit OS before.

Haha, wow, I feel like such a n00b asking all of this. But hey, you gotta learn somewhere. Thanks for the advice guys.

[KillerShots]

Originally Posted by Mako Eyes

Yea, I was looking into OpenSUSE. It looked very nice, but it requires 6 CDs (or one DVD) which I do not have on hand right now. I'm home from college on my mother's computer where the Internet is great, but she doesn't have a DVD recorder and I have only one CD left. I'll probably torrent the DVD version when I get back to college, even though it might take days to download because the connection there is so horrid. I'd like to try out a bunch of distributions.

Look for a network install solution for whatever distro you choose

Originally Posted by Mako Eyes

Yea, I know about the ATi drivers, that's good. What about my Sound Blaster Audigy 2 and SATA hard drive? I'm not much worried about my networking card and whatnot, as that can probably run on standard drivers just fine. Also, my own computer has an Athlon64, so I'm considering installing a 64-bit distribution on it. Are there 64-bit Linux drivers available?

Audigy works using the emu10k1 alsa drivers. SATA may or may not work depending on your SATA chipset. Mine works fine (I'm using an nForce4 chipset).

Originally Posted by Mako Eyes

Thanks, I'll keep Wine HQ in mind. As stated above, I'm using an Athlon64, would this limit the programs I have available to me? I have never had the opportunity to switch to a 64-bit OS before.

The CPU itself will not limit the software available. Using a 64-bit OS might. For the most part, nearly everything works on my 64-bit gentoo installation, but I cannot use win32codecs for videos and I cannot play games via cedega (emulation libraries don't work too well). Beyond that, it all seems to work well.

[Mako Eyes]

Originally Posted by KillerShots

Audigy works using the emu10k1 alsa drivers. SATA may or may not work depending on your SATA chipset. Mine works fine (I'm using an nForce4 chipset).

Then I shouldn't have any worries as I too use an nForce4 chipset. I don't have to install third party drivers for my SATA hard drive whenever I install Windows either, so I guess that amounts to it.

Originally Posted by KillerShots

The CPU itself will not limit the software available. Using a 64-bit OS might. For the most part, nearly everything works on my 64-bit gentoo installation, but I cannot use win32codecs for videos and I cannot play games via cedega (emulation libraries don't work too well). Beyond that, it all seems to work well.

Hm, that makes it look less-attractive. I'll probably stick with the 32-bit editions. What advantage does using the 64-bit versions have anyway?

[KillerShots]

Originally Posted by Mako Eyes

Hm, that makes it look less-attractive. I'll probably stick with the 32-bit editions. What advantage does using the 64-bit versions have anyway?

The 32-bit versions tend to be "safer" for general usage. The 64-bit versions offer greater speed and the ability to access large address spaces natively, rather than doing it the hard way (not very useful yet).

I'm still not sure why only a few software designers have bothered supporting 64-bit machines and operating systems - It's hard to find a 32-bit CPU any more.

[Mako Eyes]

Originally Posted by KillerShots

I'm still not sure why only a few software designers have bothered supporting 64-bit machines and operating systems - It's hard to find a 32-bit CPU any more.

You're right there. However, although the number of 64-bit hardware users is increasing, there still aren't many people using 64-bit operating systems. So I'm guessing there really isn't a big enough demand for 64-bit software as of yet to produce a market for it.

[darth sephiroth]

suse... punktum finalé!
there isn't any better linux distribution for newbies!
(probably been mentioned before, i didn't feel like reading through the earlier suggestions)

[Mako Eyes]

Heh, alright. I'm back at my dorm on my good computer. I have five Linux CDs here (Kubuntu and Ubuntu 6.10 and their 64-bit versions and Mandriva GNOME) and every single one of them failed to launch.

Ubuntu and Kubuntu will seem to start up like normal until they get about 95-99% done, then I get a corrupted screen (it seems to be at the point where the dialogue with the icons comes up saying what component is starting up). Their 64-bit counterparts' boot screen are even more messed up with funky gray colors and whatnot. Mandriva was the only one that gave me any feedback; said that X-Server failed to load my graphical interface. Could this be the same problem the -buntu family is experiencing? How exactly would I get around this?

It's odd that Kubuntu worked absolutely fine on my old computer (we're talking at least seven-year old hardware here). It's also odd that Kubuntu was the only one of the three (because two of the five were 64-bit versions) that could work on it.

[DoktorSeven]

What graphics card do you have?

Check the install options when you first boot, is there an option for some sort of reduced graphics (or maybe even text-mode) install? Obviously the default X drivers don't like your system's graphics card/monitor setup for some reason.

[Mako Eyes]

Originally Posted by DoktorSeven

What graphics card do you have?

Check the install options when you first boot, is there an option for some sort of reduced graphics (or maybe even text-mode) install? Obviously the default X drivers don't like your system's graphics card/monitor setup for some reason.

Sapphire ATi Radeon X800 PCI-Express. That could very well be the problem, but people claim that they have started Ubuntu on a PCI-E Radeon running on the same chipset (nForce4) without any problems. However, I'll give your suggestion a shot.

[DoktorSeven]

Possible that the default X drivers isn't supporting the ATi you have, I've heard that sometimes it won't. Might have to select standard VESA (generic) video drivers instead of the X ATI drivers to get it up and running, then go install the proprietary ATi drivers after install, which should work properly.

[darth sephiroth]

or try 6.06, since 6.1 has a lot of hardware issues that earlier versions don't have.

[Mako Eyes]

Originally Posted by darth sephiroth

or try 6.06, since 6.1 has a lot of hardware issues that earlier versions don't have.

Dammit. I knew I should have kept that Kubuntu 6.06 CD. I discarded it after I tried them out on my old computer and decided I liked it. I guess I'll just have to re-download it to try it out, something that will cause many-a-headache on this horrible network my college has me on.

[KillerShots]

Originally Posted by DoktorSeven

Possible that the default X drivers isn't supporting the ATi you have, I've heard that sometimes it won't. Might have to select standard VESA (generic) video drivers instead of the X ATI drivers to get it up and running, then go install the proprietary ATi drivers after install, which should work properly.

I concur. Both the ATI and nVidia open source drivers have problems with some ATI and nVidia cards. The safest thing you can do is install on vesa, then connect you your manufacturer's web site and download those drivers. Also, until you have X working the way you want it to, you may want it to boot to a console rather than straight to X so you can tinker with it until it works.

[Mako Eyes]

Originally Posted by KillerShots

I concur. Both the ATI and nVidia open source drivers have problems with some ATI and nVidia cards. The safest thing you can do is install on vesa, then connect you your manufacturer's web site and download those drivers. Also, until you have X working the way you want it to, you may want it to boot to a console rather than straight to X so you can tinker with it until it works.

Alright, now you lost me. I don't know how to get Linux to boot up in vesa mode (I'm guessing I need the alternate ISO) and booting to a console is useless because I really wouldn't know what to do with it. The last time I used a command line was when I had my old Tandy1000. Looks like I'm going to have to resort to a tutorial or something. I was hoping I'd at least get it RUNNING so I can view the tutorial and do what it says on the fly, but I guess not.

Thanks for your assistance guys! Any more advice will be greatly appreciated.

[Xtreme2damax]

Where can I find a good linux distro with xgl and compiz included?

I use ubuntu currently, but will have problems trying to download the updates and xgl, especially when the FAP kicks in at 176 megabytes with my satellite ISP.

I'm looking for a website that will allow me to download a distro with xgl and compiz included in the download, and allow me to use my download manager, and resume my download after the Fap has lifted.

Those that don't know what fap is, it's a policy called the fair access policy. with my ISP, If you use or download 176 megabytes of (Doesn't matter if you are downloading a file or surfing the web) They can severely limit and cripple your speed's. It's essentially they are saying, "If you use more than your alloted bandwidth, we can take your 712k, 512k Downstream, and 128k - 256k Uptstream, and limit or cripple you down to dial-up speed.


Thanks if anyone can provide me with a link to a free distro that includes these in the download.

[KillerShots]

Originally Posted by Mako Eyes

Alright, now you lost me. I don't know how to get Linux to boot up in vesa mode (I'm guessing I need the alternate ISO) and booting to a console is useless because I really wouldn't know what to do with it. The last time I used a command line was when I had my old Tandy1000. Looks like I'm going to have to resort to a tutorial or something. I was hoping I'd at least get it RUNNING so I can view the tutorial and do what it says on the fly, but I guess not.

Thanks for your assistance guys! Any more advice will be greatly appreciated.

Vesa mode is simply using a different video driver for X windows. Instead of saying you have an nVidia card of an ATI card during your install, say you have a Vesa card. That should get you through the install process