FFVII black triangles?

[22point8]

Sorry to revive an old thread, I also have the black triangles issue. It also happens in FF7, FF8 and Spyro the Dragon, haven't tried other games. The Error occurs in Pete's OGL 1.76 and OGL2 2.8 plugins in EPSXE 1.52, 1.60 and PSXEVEN. I have Vista x64 and an X1600 pro.

I figure the problem might be solved here sooner than AMD/ATI can. I'm using Catalyst 7.11 and have used all versions since 7.2 and this problem has happened in all of them.

Using OpenGL extensions viewer all the tests work but it says I have no ICD installed, whereas on my other computer with a Nvidia FX5200 it does.

Does anyone know if Nikk's NextGL works, and if so how to set it up?

Attached Images

ff8 opengl.JPG (78.0 KB, 41 views)

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[Squall-Leonhart]

your using Vista, thats the problem

there is currently no fix available

if Pete releases a new OGL build, it will likely be fixed then

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[RedLion]

Hello 22point8 and welcome to emuforums.
Can you post your plugins specs please? (when you open the plugin configuration, click on "copy to clipboard").

[22point8]

Thanks for the welcome RedLion, here are the settings

Plugin: Pete's OpenGL2 Driver 2.8
Author: Pete Bernert
Card vendor: ATI Technologies Inc.
GFX card: Radeon X1600/X1650 Series

Resolution/Color:
- 640x480 Window mode
- Internal X resolution: 2
- Internal Y resolution: 2
- Keep psx aspect ratio: off
- No render-to-texture: [

Ü

- Filtering: 4
- Hi-Res textures: 2
- TexWin pixel shader: off
- VRam size: 256 MBytes

Framerate:
- FPS limitation: on
- Frame skipping: off
- FPS limit: Auto

Compatibility:
- Offscreen drawing: 1
- Framebuffer effects: 2
- Framebuffer uploads: 2

Misc:
- Scanlines: off
- Mdec filter: off
- Screen filtering: off
- Shader effects: 0/1
- Flicker-fix border size: 0
- GF4/XP crash fix: off
- Game fixes: on [00001001]

I don't think they is much that configuring can change, I once sat with a piece of paper testing the filtering, offscreen drawing, and framebuffer options and got the same thing every time. As Squall-Lionhart said, it seems to be a Vista issue that somehow affects how the plugins interact with Vista, also I have DEP disabled and run epsxe and psxeven as administrator.

I'm thinking the only solutions are a new Pete plugin, or NextGL if I can ever figure out the configs.

DirectX works fine but doesn't look as good and there is no battle swirl in ff7

OpenGL extensions viewer tells me this...

Core features

v1.1 (100 % - 7/7)
v1.2 (100 % - 8/8)
v1.3 (100 % - 9/9)
v1.4 (100 % - 15/15)
v1.5 (100 % - 3/3)
v2.0 (100 % - 10/10)
v2.1 (100 % - 3/3)
OpenGL driver version check (Current: 2.1.7056 Release, Latest known: 2.1.7056 Release):
Latest version of display drivers found

According the database, you are running the latest display drivers for your video card.
No ICD registry entry

The current OpenGL driver doesn't expose the SOFTWARE/Microsoft/Windows (NT)/CurrentVersion/OpenGLDrivers registry entry. Unable to detect the driver version, driver revision name and filename.

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Last edited by 22point8; December 3rd, 2007 at 22:52.. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

[22point8]

Sorry for double post, with NextGL 1.12 the black triangles are gone from the world map, but everything is really slow and the menus are messed up, as seen in screen shot, I'm still experimenting...

Attached Images

nextgl battle.JPG (61.3 KB, 51 views)

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[RedLion]

Well I find it strange... I noticed you and the creator of the thread had radeons....Well let's tweak a little.
Have you tried to lower the internal resolution? Disable high resolutions textures? Also have you tried to update your drivers if it hadn't already done? You can also try Omega drivers for radeons in order to see if it solves the issue.

[22point8]

Yes, I've tried all sorts of resolutions, 320x200, 320x240, 352x288, PSP resolution 480x272 and multiples of them, and the internal XY. Hi Res 2xsai, none, stretched, game fixes relating to the ogl icd/ati cards. I'll try installing the XP drivers as I have a feeling the 64 bit version of vista doesn't allow unsigned drivers unless you disable driver signing at each boot.

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[Squall-Leonhart]

Originally Posted by RedLion

Well I find it strange... I noticed you and the creator of the thread had radeons....Well let's tweak a little.
Have you tried to lower the internal resolution? Disable high resolutions textures? Also have you tried to update your drivers if it hadn't already done? You can also try Omega drivers for radeons in order to see if it solves the issue.

Attn Pete: OpenGL GPU Plugin, vertex buffer/primitive assembly bug - Pete`s Messageboard Forum

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[22point8]

Performance issues w/ Pete's OpenGL2 2.8 and Vista/Vista ATI Drivers

This is a thread I found a while back with the exact same problem, btw RedLion I tried installing the XP drivers and it said "this is not xp/2000" and when I installed Omega the device manager still showed the 7.11 drivers

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[RedLion]

Originally Posted by Squall-Leonhart

Attn Pete: OpenGL GPU Plugin, vertex buffer/primitive assembly bug - Pete`s Messageboard Forum

Thanks. But nothing was lose to try see if the problem was solveable by some tweaking.

Originally Posted by 22point8

Performance issues w/ Pete's OpenGL2 2.8 and Vista/Vista ATI Drivers

This is a thread I found a while back with the exact same problem, btw RedLion I tried installing the XP drivers and it said "this is not xp/2000" and when I installed Omega the device manager still showed the 7.11 drivers

I doubt xp drivers would accept to run on Vista , knowing the way vista handles them. And Omegas drivers do not inevitably changes the version.

Well.I guess you'll need to stick with Pete's DX plugin or the P.E.OP.s software plugin (will solve the battle swirl who doesn't appear but no hardware acceleration).

[sak777]

Why would you want to play the emulated version of final fantasy 7. The computer version has a bunch of things added to it and it's made for pc so it would run much better. If you use an xp or vista, there are special patches to make it work on those OS.

[MasterPhW]

Originally Posted by sak777

Why would you want to play the emulated version of final fantasy 7. The computer version has a bunch of things added to it and it's made for pc so it would run much better. If you use an xp or vista, there are special patches to make it work on those OS.

Just read that: Q-Gears Homepage and you should know why he wants to use the PSX version... and probably he hasn't the PC Version, only his PSX version he wants to play on a emulator.

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[22point8]

Hello again, just to report this also happens in FF9 but only in certain circumstances and the game mostly plays at full speed, with slight slowdowns on the world map.

The strange thing is the triangles are all over the world map at altitude such as outside Dali or Lindblum, but outside Evil Forest/Burmecia there are none, the only other time it happens is the trance animation with the bits of lightening like energy but thats over in 2 seconds.

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[GaveUpTomorrow]

Originally Posted by MasterPhW

Just read that: Q-Gears Homepage and you should know why he wants to use the PSX version... and probably he hasn't the PC Version, only his PSX version he wants to play on a emulator.

I can understand why he would want to run the PS1 version in terms of emulation, but I have both the PC version and the PS1 version, and neither sucks. I owned the PC version first and beat it three times before getting the PS1 version, and both versions are pretty similar all around. Honestly, the PC port did not suck as bad as that site makes it sound...I mean, common, I played it perfectly on my old Pentium 2 with a 8mb video card

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[Squall-Leonhart]

it was made for such a computer... thats why.

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[Lobo]

Originally Posted by LouiseBrooks

I have the same problem using OpenGL plugins. It's a well reported Vista issue. Vista's OpenGL performance wasn't that impressive when compared to WinXP.

I know ATI (Catalyst drivers) is trying to boost its OpenGL performance under Vista, but I don't know if Pete (creator of plugin) is doing the same.

Try Omega drivers and tell us if fixes the problem.

Greets.

Originally Posted by Squall-Leonhart

your using Vista, thats the problem

there is currently no fix available

if Pete releases a new OGL build, it will likely be fixed then

if it was a vista issue, I'd be experiencing it too -- more than likely it's an ATI issue (perhaps vista's OGL library is giving them trouble, woulnd't be the first, second or third OS ATi's had trouble with OGL in). Works fine on my nVidia card. I'd be more inclined to believe it's a shader problem since for 3 years I couldn't use OGL to it's fullest on my XP machine thanks to ATI's crap drivers (low FPS, no shaders in NWN...effects not showing in Quake 3 etc...).

And even after ATi got that stuff working it was still slower than their D3D performance - it's part of the reason I moved to nVidia (mainly because there's no Direct 3D in Linux, and I began using Linux...and wanted to play my games I had for it...ATi's drivers available for Linux again were pitiful...made me sick of them...and this was just spring last year).

Besides, if it were a compatability issue with Pete's and Vista, changing the executable to run in XP SP2 mode should (and probably would) fix that.

More than likely it's an incompatibility (incompitent OGL team at AMD/ATI) with ATI's drivers and Pete's that surfaced in Vista's drivers because ATI just can't seem to get OGL drivers working like every other chipset manufacturer on the planet.

Forgive me, but I really...really hated all the tribulations I went through with OGL because of ATi. And I am also sick of seeing people blame Vista for problems. If nVidia, S3, and intel (yeah my onboard GPU on my old laptop) can run OGL stuff fine with Vista (and yeah I use OGL2 plugin on the laptop)...ATi is doing something wrong. Because if it were Vista, I'd have trouble on all my machines. If Vista is responsible, its only in the round about way of being too new for ATi's inept OGL driver team to grasp.

Anywho, actually attempting to help now, there's probably a setting in ATi's drivers to reverse to a previous OGL revision, or I bet it could be fixed with a setting like "Force 24-bit Z-Buffer depth" in the OGL settings of Catalyst, or the "Force Vertex Cache for Iris" or "Export OpenGL 2.0 Procedures"? If I were you, I'd be tweaking my Catalyst Drivers all over the place wherever it mentioned OGL just to see what, if any reaction the setting had with the OGL plug-in you're using.

Originally Posted by sak777

Why would you want to play the emulated version of final fantasy 7. The computer version has a bunch of things added to it and it's made for pc so it would run much better. If you use an xp or vista, there are special patches to make it work on those OS.

I can think of a few reasons: but the two most important are 1) he may not own the PC version and 2) he wants to play the PS version (whole lotta patching just to get VII PC working, looking and sounding right).

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Last edited by Lobo; December 9th, 2007 at 12:45..

[Squall-Leonhart]

Originally Posted by Lobo

if it was a vista issue, I'd be experiencing it too -- more than likely it's an ATI issue (perhaps vista's OGL library is giving them trouble, woulnd't be the first, second or third OS ATi's had trouble with OGL in). Works fine on my nVidia card. I'd be more inclined to believe it's a shader problem since for 3 years I couldn't use OGL to it's fullest on my XP machine thanks to ATI's crap drivers (low FPS, no shaders in NWN...effects not showing in Quake 3 etc...).

And even after ATi got that stuff working it was still slower than their D3D performance - it's part of the reason I moved to nVidia (mainly because there's no Direct 3D in Linux, and I began using Linux...and wanted to play my games I had for it...ATi's drivers available for Linux again were pitiful...made me sick of them...and this was just spring last year).

Besides, if it were a compatability issue with Pete's and Vista, changing the executable to run in XP SP2 mode should (and probably would) fix that.

More than likely it's an incompatibility (incompitent OGL team at AMD/ATI) with ATI's drivers and Pete's that surfaced in Vista's drivers because ATI just can't seem to get OGL drivers working like every other chipset manufacturer on the planet.

Forgive me, but I really...really hated all the tribulations I went through with OGL because of ATi. And I am also sick of seeing people blame Vista for problems. If nVidia, S3, and intel (yeah my onboard GPU on my old laptop) can run OGL stuff fine with Vista (and yeah I use OGL2 plugin on the laptop)...ATi is doing something wrong. Because if it were Vista, I'd have trouble on all my machines. If Vista is responsible, its only in the round about way of being too new for ATi's inept OGL driver team to grasp.

Anywho, actually attempting to help now, there's probably a setting in ATi's drivers to reverse to a previous OGL revision, or I bet it could be fixed with a setting like "Force 24-bit Z-Buffer depth" in the OGL settings of Catalyst, or the "Force Vertex Cache for Iris" or "Export OpenGL 2.0 Procedures"? If I were you, I'd be tweaking my Catalyst Drivers all over the place wherever it mentioned OGL just to see what, if any reaction the setting had with the OGL plug-in you're using.



I can think of a few reasons: the music just doesn't sound like it's supposed to with the crappy midi stuff they used in the PC version. And the pre-rendered backdrops look bad bad bad at high res. The controller implementation is also a chore just to get up and running. With ePSXe he can make it look better than the PC version could hope to, get sounds as they were supposed to be heard.

But the most important reason would be that perhaps he doesn't own the PC version. I own them both, finished it on both, and will never play the PC version again.

Yes you can patch the music in FF7 PC -- but why go through the hassle of pirating mp3's and getting all those patches to work when you can simply pop in FF7 PSX and run it with ePSXe w/o problems (well...usually ).

Yes its a Vista ATI ICD issue,
Yes Vista has other issues with Emulators that like to recomp code (DEP RELATED)
Yes, Vista is a giant compilation of Bug code, around a semi functional GUI.

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[RedLion]

Originally Posted by Squall-Leonhart

Yes, Vista is a giant compilation of Bug code, around a semi functional GUI.

This is meaby HS...but...meh....I hope you know a little how to code and that you already participate to the making of an OS to say that.

[Squall-Leonhart]

Originally Posted by RedLion

This is meaby HS...but...meh....I hope you know a little how to code and that you already participate to the making of an OS to say that.

i know a little, im learning as i do stuff with VBA-M, but its general consensus on Vista that its a steaming pile of ****

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[Lobo]

Originally Posted by Squall-Leonhart

Yes its a Vista ATI ICD issue,
Yes Vista has other issues with Emulators that like to recomp code (DEP RELATED)
Yes, Vista is a giant compilation of Bug code, around a semi functional GUI.

Then why don't nVidia or Intel cards experience this? All goes back to that ICD problem from ATi, and stops there. The stuff you're talking about is months and months old with Vista and nVidia's ICD...I'm not sure when Intel got their stuff working but I've got a laptop w/ Intel and Vista which works fine with ePSXe and OGL2 plugin and FF7. Since I hadn't played FF7 at all since Vista was released I thought maybe I might experience it too since people were talking about the issues being Vista related, and hopefully be able to find a fix. The simplest fix so far is...don't use ATi for OGL2, they have over a decade of bad OGL support. nVidia's bad OGL support comes in spurts but gets fixed quick.

In short, Vista has no issues with FF7 under ePSXe w/ my nvidia 7800 or intel 950. No matter how you want to bad mouth Vista, in this case, it's all on ATi.

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Last edited by Lobo; December 9th, 2007 at 22:18..