Help With Parts for a New PC?

[Lord Zedeck]

First off, hi. I haven't been here in a while. I'm in a situation of needing a new PC and remembered you guys are probably some of the most technically inclined hardware-wise I know.

On to the matter at hand, my main PC went when a power outtage hit (and my television's color convergence went as well). The motherboard and CPU went, and as far as I know, everything else is good. The PC mainly consisted of an AMD Athlon 64 3200+ (not an X2 dual core), 1GB PC3200 DDR Ram, and a GeForce 6800GS AGP modded to an Ultra. Since it's a bit aged and I was planning to upgrade sometime in the near future, I'm just going to plan the new PC now instead of replacing parts of an older one when some of those may be wonky now too. Since I didn't anticipate the problem I face, I probably won't have all of the money right away yet for two to maybe three months, but I hope to plan a bit now (and I may buy the peices part by part, or is that a bad idea?).

My use of the PC will be as a high(er) end, but not super high-end, machine for gaming and general use. I do have interest in moderate overclocking (you'd be wasting a Core 2 Duo NOT to!), but, it's not a heavy priority. I'll start the budget at around $1,000 (these are US prices), but may go as high as around $1,500 if that gets me less than I'm hoping, but anything more and I'll probably cut back on parts. I don't know what prices are like these days versus two and a half years ago, but that got you a decent machine then. I've been out of the loop for that time (back when AMD still ruled), so onto the newegg links and questions, engh?

How's this for starts? Single core no more, but I don't think I'll need as much as a quad core yet.
Newegg.com - Intel Core 2 Duo E6750 Conroe 2.66GHz 4M shared L2 Cache LGA 775 Processor - Retail

Is this good for cooling/not extreme overclocking?
Newegg.com - ARCTIC COOLING Freezer 7 Pro 92mm CPU Cooler - Retail

Which of these motherboards is better? Alternatively, feel free to recommend something else entirely if you wish. Motherboards were never my strong point since this'll basically be the first time I've overclocked something other than a GPU. Id prefer support for quad core down the line. I won't do SLI, so one PCIe is enough. I don't know what the difference is with PCIe 2.0, since it seems to be listed as the same x16 the current one is. I'll only need one PCI port for a sound card later on.
Newegg.com - Open Box: ASUS P5K PREMIUM/WIFI-AP LGA 775 Intel P35 ATX Intel Motherboard
Newegg.com - Open Box: ASUS MAXIMUS FORMULA / SE LGA 775 Intel X38 ATX Intel Motherboard

I'm even more lost on RAM, and why is it so cheap these days? I figure I'll go with 4GB, since it's cheaper that way than getting 2GB now and 2GB later. This seems really little low in price for what appears to be good specs and alot of capacity, though what do I know, so what's the catch? I heard DDR2 was just mass produced so prices are down, but that still seems really low for 4GB. I want RAM that will overclock well, but doesn't have to be the best. I just get lost on timings and all that.
Newegg.com - G.SKILL 4GB(2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory - Retail

Hard Drives I think I have set. I'll just get two of these (and the space will be enough for me).
Newegg.com - Western Digital Caviar SE16 WD3200AAKS 320GB 7200 RPM 16MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - OEM

And to feed it's thirst, is this good to power it all? If no, I prefer a single beefy rail to many smaller ones, and modular cabling isn't important to me at all. I have a Thermaltake 430 Watt PSU now (decent, but ridiculously low effeciency), but that won't cut it. I've heard alot about PC Power & Cooling, so I wanted to see what the fuss was about with that brand and this appeared good.
Newegg.com - PC Power & Cooling Silencer 610 EPS12V EPS12V 610W Continuous @ 40°C Power Supply 100 - 240 V UL, cUL, CE, CB, TUV - Retail

For the case and cooling, I don't know yet. I'm open to suggestions, but note the PSU appears to need a bit more than normal room from what the reviews say. It doesn't need to be super fancy. I'm concerned about airflow over looks. I'll be going with air cooling. I also don't want the machine to be super loud, but I don't need it to be silent either.

You may notice the lack of a video card by now. I'm fairly sure I'll be getting a single 8800GT, and then upgrading to the high end 9 series around when it comes out (first half of next year?). Make recommendations on brand if you wish, but other than that, I think I have this area decided.

I THINK that's it. I have the OS (XP Pro 32-bit primary [I'm aware of the ~3GB limitation], and Vista Home Premium 64-bit secondary), mouse, keyboard, monitor, speakers, all from my current system, and will get a soundcard down the line, but unless I'm missing anything, how's this look for now? What will the performance be like versus my previous system, and is it decently balanced or is one area a bottleneck? Sorry for all of the questions, but this happens when you take your eyes off the hardware world for a second, let alone two years. Things are SO much different now.

[tuanming]

You don't need the ASUS MAXIMUS FORMULA... That's for the hardcore enthusiast who tends to do xtreme overclocking and it's usually goes well along with quadcore . If you want to save more money then go with these:

CPU: Intel Core 2 Duo E6550 Conroe 2.33GHz (shave off $20 from the E6750!) Newegg.com - Intel Core 2 Duo E6550 Conroe 2.33GHz 4M shared L2 Cache LGA 775 Processor - Retail

Mobo: Asus P5B $110 (Newer and $20 cheaper compared to the used p5k-deluxe) Newegg.com - ASUS P5B LGA 775 Intel P965 Express ATX Intel Motherboard - Retail

PSU: OCZ GameXstream 700 watts $95 ($25 cheaper than PC Power & Cooling) after $35 mail and rebate (lots of positive reviews and high efficiency) Newegg.com - OCZ GameXStream OCZ700GXSSLI ATX12V 700W Power Supply 100 - 240 V - Retail

RAM: G.Skill 2x2gb $110 (again, lots of customer positive reviews and $20 cheaper) Newegg.com - G.SKILL 4GB(2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory - Retail

With these I'm pretty sure you could easily do 3Ghz or more... On mine rig, i could run 3.3 - 3.4Ghz on a stock voltage Since you said you only want to do moderate overclocking. I think these components suit your taste even if you don't plan on overclocking at all. You'll save $85 with this set up

[Lord Zedeck]

Okay, the motherboard and RAM sounds good. I guess prices these days are cheaper than days gone by.

I don't mind the extra $20 on the CPU though. From what I heard, the E6750 is worth the small extra cost becuase of the extra multiplier? Either way, unless the E6550 is better at overclocking, I don't mind spending the extra $20.

I'll consider the PSU, but wouldn't I want to prefer one large +12V rail? I heard multiple rails trap power, though again, multiple rails were sort of rare and new last I kept up with this, so I'm going more on what I heard than know. I'm still trying to catch up all at one time and am lost. If that's a better and cheaper PSU, I'll look into it.

Thanks for the advice.

Oh, and I knew I forgot something. I'll need a DVD+RW drive (my current one is a CD-RW drive and a DVD read only drive). I'll probably just pick whatever I find for that though.

Now I need a case and cooling for it.

Edit: not sure where you found the new motherboard, but thanks. Maybe it was just me, but EVERY one I saw was open box.

[tuanming]

Originally Posted by Lord Zedeck

Okay, the motherboard and RAM sounds good. I guess prices these days are cheaper than days gone by.

I don't mind the extra $20 on the CPU though. From what I heard, the E6750 is worth the small extra cost becuase of the extra multiplier? Either way, unless the E6550 is better at overclocking, I don't mind spending the extra $20.

I'll consider the PSU, but wouldn't I want to prefer one large +12V rail? I heard multiple rails trap power, though again, multiple rails were sort of rare and new last I kept up with this, so I'm going more on what I heard than know. I'm still trying to catch up all at one time and am lost. If that's a better and cheaper PSU, I'll look into it.

Thanks for the advice.

Oh, and I knew I forgot something. I'll need a DVD+RW drive (my current one is a CD-RW drive and a DVD read only drive). I'll probably just pick whatever I find for that though.

Now I need a case and cooling for it.

Edit: not sure where you found the new motherboard, but thanks. Maybe it was just me, but EVERY one I saw was open box.

Those only apply to the old, old psu or cheap psu which wasn't efficient enough to distribute all the power to designated location: where it's needed the power most, which led to bottlenecking the entire system due to insufficient power distribution. Which is why high energies efficiency power supply are key to the solution.

[skoreanime]

The Premium version of the P5K is a waste of money unless you fully intend to use all those extra features...which many, many people don't . But I would go with the P5B if you don't plan on upgrading for another few years.

In my rig, I'm using a OCZ 600W to power up all that, so 700W should be sufficient for you. IMO, go with a Seagate 7200.10RPM 320GBx2 hard drives and put them in RAID0 with the Intel Matrix storage. So much faster, cheaper and bigger storage size then Raptor drives .

The RAM you picked is solid, all reviews on it gives it a good score, for both stock and overclocking. Oh, and the reason DDR2 RAM is so cheap nowadays is because of the DDR3 release into the market. Suppliers have a lot stocked up and want to get rid of them fast so they can start stocking up on DDR3 .

The CPU and the CPU cooler, E6750 and Arctic Freezer Pro 7 are very common, but solid picks IMO. A friend of mine has both of those and his machine is solid.

And go with the 8800GT. Two of my friends got one and they're pretty much matching me in game FPS (most of the time beating though ) with the games we play.

[Lord Zedeck]

tuanming, I had a chance to look more into the links you posted (I had to leave earlier and only glimpsed at them) and noticed a few things. They seem to be cheaper becuase they're inferior.

The RAM has timings of 5-5-5-15 as opposed to 4-4-4-12. That was one thing I looked for. I heard RAM that isn't up to par can really hinder overclocking.

As for the motherboard, it doesn't seem to support 1333MHz FSB, which the E6750 uses. Wouldn't that be a problem? I won't be going after overclocking hardcore (and I realized after seeing the CPU being cheaper than the second motherboard that it was overkill), but I don't want an inferior board that will limit me either. What skoreanime said comes to mind. I want to future proof it a bit. I don't want to be stuck needing to upgrade the motherboard down the road. I'd preferably like it to last a good two to two and a half years or so. I'd also like the extra features should I get into that more.

As for the PSU, is dual versus single rails down to preference then? If so, I'll ignore that factor and get the better PSU, which seems to be the one you suggested. I think 600 watts would be plenty, but I'll future proof it, sure.

Originally Posted by skoreanime

IMO, go with a Seagate 7200.10RPM 320GBx2 hard drives and put them in RAID0 with the Intel Matrix storage. So much faster, cheaper and bigger storage size then Raptor drives

I was thinking of 10k drives, and will consider it, but I've heard they are pretty noisy. Do you have links to the drive you're suggesting?

[tuanming]

People who are looking toward moderate overclocking shouldn't be worrying about hardwares specs. 4-4-4-12 vs 5-5-5-15 in overclocking terms doesn't do much for Intel Core 2 processor. Cas 5 is more of a relax timing and Cas 4 is a tighter, it really depends on the application you are running it on. Some apps does take advantage of cas 4, but the differences is hardly noticeable because the gains are very marginal in most cases

Just because it's cas 5, it doesn't mean that it can't do a measly 3.0Ghz+ with the E6750. Of course this only apply to G.Skill rams, I can't say the same for other rams You said you looked at the ram i mentioned, but did you read the customer reviews? Now thats the big question.

As for the motherboard, 1066 vs 1333 mhz is almost like cas 4 vs cas 5 and again, it really depends on the application. A bios update should do the trick if you're still mystified by it...

About the OCZ psu, I think it look nicer than the PC Power and Cooling. More of a personal preference if you ask me . 700 watts is just more tastier for my appetite

Any more questions? It really up to you if you want to take my advice or not. I'm just telling you that cheaper stuff ($20-25 off/each component) can do the same thing as the higher cost ones. But if you were to high overclocking like 3.5Gzh and up then thing would change a bit (required better components)

[PCXL-Fan]

Johnnyguru the most reliable and #1 source for everything psu related doesn't put the ocz at a high ranking like other top tier psus.

Read his list of the top tier psus
PSU Recommendations for High End Gaming PC's - jonnyGURU.net Forums

he has a little blurb at the end about ppl with ocz psus
I'm not saying its a bad psu its just that there are much preferable ones out there, especially if your planning on overclocking alot and having powerful gpu(s) and it will be more future proof, so when you decide to upgrade your computer 2-3 years down the line you can save $170 provided it has 8pin gpu power connector(s).

[tuanming]

Seems like Johnnyguru forgot to provide some facts to back up his claims. He's also forgot to mention/add that customer reviews are/can be a primary source when looking for pc hardwares or in this case, a power supply. I tend to go with the customer reviews when i don't have the same hardware to base my opinion on, or just do a bit of researching aka editorial's reviewer.

[PCXL-Fan]

I'm pretty sure the reviews exist but like ngemu you have to search the website and forums. The administrators and moderators there probably expect ppl to have the patience to search for them. Anyways the senior members of anandtech forums always link people to jonnyGURU's Personal Website to get their psu info.

Okay here's the review for OCZ GameXtreme 700W. jonnyGURU's Personal Website

[Lord Zedeck]

Originally Posted by tuanming

People who are looking toward moderate overclocking shouldn't be worrying about hardwares specs. 4-4-4-12 vs 5-5-5-15 in overclocking terms doesn't do much for Intel Core 2 processor. Cas 5 is more of a relax timing and Cas 4 is a tighter, it really depends on the application you are running it on. Some apps does take advantage of cas 4, but the differences is hardly noticeable because the gains are very marginal in most cases

Just because it's cas 5, it doesn't mean that it can't do a measly 3.0Ghz+ with the E6750. Of course this only apply to G.Skill rams, I can't say the same for other rams You said you looked at the ram i mentioned, but did you read the customer reviews? Now thats the big question.

As for the motherboard, 1066 vs 1333 mhz is almost like cas 4 vs cas 5 and again, it really depends on the application. A bios update should do the trick if you're still mystified by it...

About the OCZ psu, I think it look nicer than the PC Power and Cooling. More of a personal preference if you ask me . 700 watts is just more tastier for my appetite

Any more questions? It really up to you if you want to take my advice or not. I'm just telling you that cheaper stuff ($20-25 off/each component) can do the same thing as the higher cost ones. But if you were to high overclocking like 3.5Gzh and up then thing would change a bit (required better components)

That's kind of what I meant. I may not know everything about overclocking now, but I may (and probably will) want to get more into it down the line, and I don't want to go to one day and realize the hardware I have is holding me back any becuase I skimped a mere $20. I'm more than willing to pay that very small extra on a few parts if they're better. I'm also trying to futureproof this a bit, so I'm trying to get a little more than I need. We all know what's enough today isn't enough tommorrow with PCs. I'm not looking for the highest ended PC ever, but I'm not aiming for a budget PC either.

I appreciate the advice, but it seems like you're telling me to lower the ante when that's not what I want to do.