ATI Sucks

Darschashkna · May 5th, 2002

Don't even say get a new video card. I haven't got the money and won't for quite some time. I've got an old as dirt ATI Rage Fury Pro and due to the crap they did when they wrote the drivers for XP, epsxe is slower than molasses now. Anyone know a way to get around the TruFORM BS they did. Right now I'm using a Voodoo3 and getting 60 fps but I miss my TV in/out.

Suggestions, comments, quotations, parenthesis, ideas?

And yes I was playing epsxe in 98 with this fine and I was getting 60 fps.

System Specs:
AMD Duron 750
256M RAM
20 Gig 5400 RPM HDD
Hercules Muse XL
ATI Rage Fury Pro 32M

Thanks

hnayoung · May 5th, 2002

Don't really know. I had the ATI rage fury also...got rid of that quick tho....that's odd that your voodoo3 3000 doesn't have a tv out. My voodoo3 3000 has a tv out. hmm..oh well.

But if you have to have the tv out...and you want to use your ati card...u may have to use a software plugin like peops to get good framerates. If i were you i'd just stick with the voodoo card you are using right now.

Darschashkna · May 5th, 2002

It's a voodoo 3 2000, not a 3000. The 2000 didn't have a TV out.

I would love to know if ATI's driver development was thinking when they royally messed up their drivers. Hmm... I know what would be cool, lets make a feature that will make framerates pathetically slow on our older cards to get people to buy our NEW cards...

I'm ready to be able to make some money... I'ts GeForce time... I have throughly had it with ATI... considering every ATI card I have ever had, has had some kind of weird quirk or driver problem which made the card completely useless is some aspect.

JAZ · May 5th, 2002

Are you saying that you have somehow got truform turned on in your drivers?
If so then no wonder that its slowing everything down, I know theres patches for some games that allow you to use truform on ati cards that dont support it in hardware but it has to be run in software and it cripple's your performance (not suprisngly as your card doesnt support it).
I had xp on my computer a while back and the driver set I used was only about 10-15% slower than win98 performance and theres been a few xp driver releases since then.
Have you tried using a different driver set?

Darschashkna · May 5th, 2002

ALL the new XP drivers have it enabled. It's some kind of BS ATI did when the XP drivers were built. I've done extensive research and everything leads to the fact that basically ATI wrote it into the drivers and it basically hogs CPU cycles no matter what due to it has to use software emulation of it. Alot of games are having the same problems with it.

Darschashkna · May 5th, 2002

but www.rageunderground has tons of people serious PO'd about it due to they have a forum just for The Rage 128/Pro series and everyone across the board almost is having the same problem with 10-20 fps in almost everything 3d they are playing with XP

Zeismond · May 6th, 2002

try looking for unofficial drivers or something

Darschashkna · May 8th, 2002

Think I haven't, only thing I found was something by PowerColor... but I think it's just leaked betas

Esturk · May 8th, 2002

Just install both cards. Use the Voodoo for games and the ATI for TV-out.

Darschashkna · May 8th, 2002

And have that kind of nightmare, both the cards sharing IRQ 11... heh.. I think I'll pass... my BIOS has a hard enough time just fighing with my sound card and USB ports..
But anywho I got the problem solved... fiddled some and was able to get back my 60 fps.. ^_^

Thanks for the help everyone.

**Kane** · May 8th, 2002

In XP, there should be no IRQ sharing probs at all. You should seen the amount of stuff I have in my machine, and the problms I don't have.

**Demigod** · May 8th, 2002

Multiple devices can share an IRQ without any problems. On my computer I have 9 devices using IRC 9 (including my network card and videocard).

evil aloha · May 8th, 2002

comments:
1. ATI Rage Fury Pro sucks!!!
2. Only the Voodoo3 3500 haves a TV in/out.

Suggestions:
1. Sell your video card and buy a new one...
2. ... like a Voodoo 4 or a GeForce 2.

Ultragunner · May 8th, 2002

Quote:

Originally posted by evil aloha
2. Only the Voodoo3 3500 haves a TV in/out.

only? the Voodoo 3 3000 also has a TV out IIRC.

Darschashkna · May 8th, 2002

Replies to....
1. Not if you're not running ACPI, which I really want to do some more research into due to I have read it combined with XP has the possibility of frying hardware, considering my Audigy worked fine till XP and then fried....
2. I agree fully that ATI sucks
3. And thankfully enough, the video card issue has been solved due to I came into enough money and it is time to use that Rage Fury Pro as a skeet and get me a GeForce2 GTS

Esturk · May 8th, 2002

ACPI means Advanced Configuration and Power Interface and it does not "fry" anything. ATI does not suck, look at the Game Cube. Pretty nice if you ask me.

BDA7DD · May 9th, 2002

Quote:

Originally posted by Darschashkna
I would love to know if ATI's driver development was thinking when they royally messed up their drivers.

Wait a minute... ATI has a driver department?

Seriously though, the only reason I refuse to buy ATI products anymore is because of their horrible, horrible driver support. Their drivers (which they pretty much release bi-annually) are constantly broken, buggy, and cause all sorts of problems on every system I've used that has an ATI card (and being a hardware technician, I've worked with plenty of 'em.)

I've never seen a single ATI card that runs nearly as well as an NVIDIA card. Which brings me to my next point. NVIDIA has been my all-time favourite video card manufacturer (well, okay, they just make the chipsets, but you know what I mean.) Their drivers rarely mess up, they've got GREAT Linux support, and they're a cinch to overclock. I just got my GeForce4 Ti4600 a month ago and I'm already loving it like it was my first born child.

As for Voodoo cards and all the other 3DFX stuff, any video card that uses a proprietary API and forces game developers to comply with it is just wrong, wrong, wrong. Yeah, you heard me, Ultragunner, I hate 3DFX with a passion. Every time I hear the word "Glide" mentioned I get shivers down my spine and a wrenching in my stomach. They're no better than Microsoft and Creative Labs when it comes to forcing software developers to comply with proprietary standards. Ggghhh...

Quote:

Originally posted by Esturk17
Just install both cards. Use the Voodoo for games and the ATI for TV-out.

Or even better... dual monitors!

Esturk · May 9th, 2002

Drivers are certainly very important. My 3rd Party Voodoo3 XP drivers are working awesome. FFVII PC works perfect. Not that I play it though. My Disk2 is scratched to hell and back!

**Demigod** · May 9th, 2002

Quote:

Originally posted by BDA7DD
As for Voodoo cards and all the other 3DFX stuff, any video card that uses a proprietary API and forces game developers to comply with it is just wrong, wrong, wrong. Yeah, you heard me, Ultragunner, I hate 3DFX with a passion. Every time I hear the word "Glide" mentioned I get shivers down my spine and a wrenching in my stomach. They're no better than Microsoft and Creative Labs when it comes to forcing software developers to comply with proprietary standards. Ggghhh...

3Dfx Glide was a really good API. As their native API, Voodoo cards ran extremely well in Glide applications. During the time Glide was pretty much the only available API for game developers (Direct3D was the only other one and it wasn't very good, OpenGL was for professional graphics) so it was adopted quickly. As Direct3D grew and matured it overshadowed Glide but it was still a very good API. Microsoft pretty much forced Direct3D down the throats of software developers (and they almost killed Nvidia because of it). If anyone's the evil one it's Microsoft (no surprise there

). 3Dfx didn't force developers to use their API, it was just the best one. As Direct3D matured and surpassed it they switched to it instead.

Darschashkna · May 9th, 2002

They release drivers bianually? *smirk* Seems to me more like when a new OS comes out and they have to write a driver to work with it.

XP Driver release date for ATI Rage Fury Pro: Oct, 2001 << 7 months

On the 3dfx, yes they did use glide, but their cards also supported d3d and OpenGL, so it was really at the discretion of the programmer.

And I'll stick to being without ACPI, one less IRQ to worry about being filled ^_^

May 5th, 2002	#1 (permalink)
Darschashkna Registered User Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 17	ATI Sucks Don't even say get a new video card. I haven't got the money and won't for quite some time. I've got an old as dirt ATI Rage Fury Pro and due to the crap they did when they wrote the drivers for XP, epsxe is slower than molasses now. Anyone know a way to get around the TruFORM BS they did. Right now I'm using a Voodoo3 and getting 60 fps but I miss my TV in/out. Suggestions, comments, quotations, parenthesis, ideas? And yes I was playing epsxe in 98 with this fine and I was getting 60 fps. System Specs: AMD Duron 750 256M RAM 20 Gig 5400 RPM HDD Hercules Muse XL ATI Rage Fury Pro 32M Thanks

May 5th, 2002	#2 (permalink)
hnayoung Surfer Dude Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: The Beach Posts: 195	Don't really know. I had the ATI rage fury also...got rid of that quick tho....that's odd that your voodoo3 3000 doesn't have a tv out. My voodoo3 3000 has a tv out. hmm..oh well. But if you have to have the tv out...and you want to use your ati card...u may have to use a software plugin like peops to get good framerates. If i were you i'd just stick with the voodoo card you are using right now. __________________ "What's wrong with taking care of a woman, she takes care of you" System Specs - Asus P4PE mobo, P4 2.53 GHz, 1024 MB DDR 333 PC 2700 ram, Sound Blaster Audigy 2 Platinum, 80 GB Maxtor Diamond Max Plus 9 7200 rpm HD, 160 GB Western Digital Caviar, Antec True Power 430 Watt PSU, Chieftec Dragon Case with Clear Side Panel, ATI Radeon 9800, Cendyne 48x16x48 CD-RW, LG 16x DVD-Burner, Hitachi 17" Gamer's LCD Monitor, Asus TV Tuner Card

May 8th, 2002	#9 (permalink)
Esturk Registered User Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Edmonton, Alberta, Canada Posts: 6,957	Just install both cards. Use the Voodoo for games and the ATI for TV-out. __________________ Necrosaro: Windows XP Pro x64 Edition SP2 \| Intel Core 2 Duo E6750 2.66GHz, 1333MHz FSB, 4MB L2 Cache \| Asus P5K Deluxe, Intel P35 Chipset, Socket 775 \| 4GB Kingston PC5300 DDR2 \| Nvidia GeForce 8800GT, 1024MB \| Creative SB X-Fi Fatality Edition \| Western Digital Raptor WD1500ADFD, 150Gb, SATA, Western Digital WD5000AAKS, 500GB, SATA \| LG 16x DVD-RWx2 SATA.

May 8th, 2002	#11 (permalink)
Kane 邪魔ゎ指せない Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Gosport, England Posts: 26,255	In XP, there should be no IRQ sharing probs at all. You should seen the amount of stuff I have in my machine, and the problms I don't have. __________________ >Site Live< Pop over to my site for help with setting up PSX emulators. Help for the Final Fantasies and other RPGs avalaible Celes: (Desktop) Athlon 64 X2 4200+, 2Gb 400MHz DDR Ram, MSI K8N Platinum, GeForce 8800 GTS 320Mb, 500Gb RAID HDD, Vista Business Erika: (MCPC) Athlon XP 2400+, 1Gb 400MHz DDR Ram, geForce 6800 256Mb, 80Gb Hdd, XP 2005 MCE Kimiko: (Desktop 2) Athlon 64 3000+, 512Mb 400MHz DDR Ram, Asus K8V, geForce 6800 128Mb

May 8th, 2002	#12 (permalink)
Demigod これはバタスです Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada Posts: 5,811	Multiple devices can share an IRQ without any problems. On my computer I have 9 devices using IRC 9 (including my network card and videocard). __________________ CPU: Intel Core 2 Quad Q9450 @ 2.66 Ghz (Yorkfield) Mobo: Intel DX48BT2 Memory: 2048 MB PC10600 DDR3 Videocard: PNY Geforce 9800 GX2 PCIe w/ 1024 MB GDDR3 Soundcard: On-board SigmaTel High Definition Audio Hard drive: 300 MB Maxtor & 1 TB Hitachi Optical drive: LG GGW-H20L (2x BD-R DL) OS: Microsoft Windows Vista (32-bit)

May 5th, 2002	#3 (permalink)
Darschashkna Registered User Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 17	It's a voodoo 3 2000, not a 3000. The 2000 didn't have a TV out. I would love to know if ATI's driver development was thinking when they royally messed up their drivers. Hmm... I know what would be cool, lets make a feature that will make framerates pathetically slow on our older cards to get people to buy our NEW cards... I'm ready to be able to make some money... I'ts GeForce time... I have throughly had it with ATI... considering every ATI card I have ever had, has had some kind of weird quirk or driver problem which made the card completely useless is some aspect.

May 5th, 2002	#4 (permalink)
JAZ Nintendo Zealot Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: UK Posts: 1,424	Are you saying that you have somehow got truform turned on in your drivers? If so then no wonder that its slowing everything down, I know theres patches for some games that allow you to use truform on ati cards that dont support it in hardware but it has to be run in software and it cripple's your performance (not suprisngly as your card doesnt support it). I had xp on my computer a while back and the driver set I used was only about 10-15% slower than win98 performance and theres been a few xp driver releases since then. Have you tried using a different driver set?

May 5th, 2002	#5 (permalink)
Darschashkna Registered User Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 17	ALL the new XP drivers have it enabled. It's some kind of BS ATI did when the XP drivers were built. I've done extensive research and everything leads to the fact that basically ATI wrote it into the drivers and it basically hogs CPU cycles no matter what due to it has to use software emulation of it. Alot of games are having the same problems with it.

May 5th, 2002	#6 (permalink)
Darschashkna Registered User Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 17	but www.rageunderground has tons of people serious PO'd about it due to they have a forum just for The Rage 128/Pro series and everyone across the board almost is having the same problem with 10-20 fps in almost everything 3d they are playing with XP

May 6th, 2002	#7 (permalink)
Zeismond Registered User Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 3	try looking for unofficial drivers or something

May 8th, 2002	#8 (permalink)
Darschashkna Registered User Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 17	Think I haven't, only thing I found was something by PowerColor... but I think it's just leaked betas

May 8th, 2002	#10 (permalink)
Darschashkna Registered User Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 17	And have that kind of nightmare, both the cards sharing IRQ 11... heh.. I think I'll pass... my BIOS has a hard enough time just fighing with my sound card and USB ports.. But anywho I got the problem solved... fiddled some and was able to get back my 60 fps.. ^_^ Thanks for the help everyone.

May 8th, 2002	#13 (permalink)
evil aloha The destiny of an angel Join Date: May 2002 Location: Brazil Posts: 208	comments: 1. ATI Rage Fury Pro sucks!!! 2. Only the Voodoo3 3500 haves a TV in/out. Suggestions: 1. Sell your video card and buy a new one... 2. ... like a Voodoo 4 or a GeForce 2. __________________ the baD Guys goes to the hell, the gOOd Guys goes to nowhere...

May 8th, 2002	#15 (permalink)
Darschashkna Registered User Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 17	Replies to.... 1. Not if you're not running ACPI, which I really want to do some more research into due to I have read it combined with XP has the possibility of frying hardware, considering my Audigy worked fine till XP and then fried.... 2. I agree fully that ATI sucks 3. And thankfully enough, the video card issue has been solved due to I came into enough money and it is time to use that Rage Fury Pro as a skeet and get me a GeForce2 GTS

May 8th, 2002	#16 (permalink)
Esturk Registered User Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Edmonton, Alberta, Canada Posts: 6,957	ACPI means Advanced Configuration and Power Interface and it does not "fry" anything. ATI does not suck, look at the Game Cube. Pretty nice if you ask me. __________________ Necrosaro: Windows XP Pro x64 Edition SP2 \| Intel Core 2 Duo E6750 2.66GHz, 1333MHz FSB, 4MB L2 Cache \| Asus P5K Deluxe, Intel P35 Chipset, Socket 775 \| 4GB Kingston PC5300 DDR2 \| Nvidia GeForce 8800GT, 1024MB \| Creative SB X-Fi Fatality Edition \| Western Digital Raptor WD1500ADFD, 150Gb, SATA, Western Digital WD5000AAKS, 500GB, SATA \| LG 16x DVD-RWx2 SATA.

May 9th, 2002	#18 (permalink)
Esturk Registered User Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Edmonton, Alberta, Canada Posts: 6,957	Drivers are certainly very important. My 3rd Party Voodoo3 XP drivers are working awesome. FFVII PC works perfect. Not that I play it though. My Disk2 is scratched to hell and back! __________________ Necrosaro: Windows XP Pro x64 Edition SP2 \| Intel Core 2 Duo E6750 2.66GHz, 1333MHz FSB, 4MB L2 Cache \| Asus P5K Deluxe, Intel P35 Chipset, Socket 775 \| 4GB Kingston PC5300 DDR2 \| Nvidia GeForce 8800GT, 1024MB \| Creative SB X-Fi Fatality Edition \| Western Digital Raptor WD1500ADFD, 150Gb, SATA, Western Digital WD5000AAKS, 500GB, SATA \| LG 16x DVD-RWx2 SATA.

May 9th, 2002	#20 (permalink)
Darschashkna Registered User Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 17	They release drivers bianually? smirk Seems to me more like when a new OS comes out and they have to write a driver to work with it. XP Driver release date for ATI Rage Fury Pro: Oct, 2001 << 7 months On the 3dfx, yes they did use glide, but their cards also supported d3d and OpenGL, so it was really at the discretion of the programmer. And I'll stick to being without ACPI, one less IRQ to worry about being filled ^_^

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