Dragon Quest VII (ePSXe w/ Pete OGL 1.70) - Page 3

finalight · April 10th, 2003

you should set it yourself

**Lewpy** · April 10th, 2003

Quote:

Originally posted by ZappaZ
hmm, im not @ home with the psx hardware but is it possible for an emu to implement z-buffer in a way that would affect the
emulated games or does z-buffer have to be programmed into the games by the developers?

By the time the draw elements have reached the GPU, they are devoid of all depth information. This means a z-buffer would be of no use, as there is no Z data to work with

Generic Ninja · April 10th, 2003

Hmm.! I thought Z-Bufer was to make things like mirrors, but I was wrong!
The cause to this was a funny yaroze RPG, (I don't remeber the name, but it started with a piano song at the begining, had 3D graphics, and the characters were very simple! When I talked to a old women, she has explained what SOPOUSING was to be a z-buffer (with some crap of course)!

Anyway, back to the topic, I have completed Dragon Quest 6 (SNES), translated by NoProgress yesterday, anyone want the save-state?

**Lewpy** · April 10th, 2003

Quote:

Originally posted by Generic Ninja
Hmm.! I thought Z-Bufer was to make things like mirrors, but I was wrong!

No, you are not wrong: a zbuffer does help when doing mirrors, as it makes sure the stuff reflected in the mirror doesn't poke through in to the "real" world

finalight · April 11th, 2003

ohh..think I got it

Generic Ninja · April 11th, 2003

Me too *_*

finalight · April 11th, 2003

so does z buffer always work perfectly?

**Lewpy** · April 12th, 2003

Quote:

Originally posted by finalight
so does z buffer always work perfectly?

No, because of the following reasons:-
1) A z-buffer is only as good as the information supplied to it. If the 3D engine is buggy and sends incorrect data (bad depth values, for example), then the z-buffer can not correct for this. The z-buffer is a "tool", and is only as good as the worksman

2) A z-buffer has a finite bit resolution, so sometimes it can have trouble deciding which object is in front if two objects are very close to each other. This normally happens when the objects are far away. Increasing the resolution of the z-buffer helps this, but that requires more video memory and more memory bandwidth. And example of this is the move from 16-bit z-buffers on the PC to 32-bit z-buffers, to avoid such distance-related z-buffer issues.

Z-buffer is a brute-force approach to depth rendering a scene (ie. every pixel is processed, whether it is actually drawn or not). Most GPU manufacturers now use some kind of High Level depth testing, to avoid rendering those objects that are definately not visible: this saves time and thus memory bandwidth.

finalight · April 14th, 2003

so what does z buffer require?

**Lewpy** · April 14th, 2003

Quote:

Originally posted by finalight
so what does z buffer require?

A z-buffer requires video memory to store current depth values, and it needs depth values specified for every vertex of every primitive drawn so it can compare them (interpolated per pixel) against the stored values.

finalight · April 14th, 2003

so better graphic card means better z buffer?

**Lewpy** · April 14th, 2003

Quote:

Originally posted by finalight
so better graphic card means better z buffer?

It depends on your definition of "better". Seriously. You really have to study the cards to know if the zbuffer implementation is "better" on one verses another card.
To be honest, the main focus of current GPUs is higher-level HSR (Hidden Surface Removal), in an effort to be more efficient. ZBuffer can only be optimised so much ("Fast Z Clears", "Z Compression", etc. all trying to save memory bandwidth).
Ultimately, tile-based rendering saves most Zbuffer bandwidth, because the zbuffer does not need to be stored off-chip in VRAM: the tile is rendered with the zbuffer kept on-chip, and the z information is discarded once the tile is fully rendered as it is no longer needed. But tile-based rendering has it's own set of side-effects.

finalight · April 14th, 2003

then what's the side effect?

**Kane** · April 14th, 2003

Have you used a Kyro chipset based card? If a game isn't specificaly programed for tile based rendering, it can cause some graphical artifacts from what I've seen.

finalight · April 15th, 2003

Sorry, but I don't know what is that...

**Kane** · April 15th, 2003

The PowerVR. Used in the DC. Made some very suck PC cards.

finalight · April 16th, 2003

so it sux too?

**Kane** · April 16th, 2003

No, just thier PC implementation of it sucks.

BeNooL · September 13th, 2003

finished the game yesterday evening by the way

I really enjoyed this game and it played so greatly in the emu

some battle shots after a very long delay

April 10th, 2003	#43 (permalink)
Generic Ninja Registered User Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Portugal Posts: 111	Hmm.! I thought Z-Bufer was to make things like mirrors, but I was wrong! The cause to this was a funny yaroze RPG, (I don't remeber the name, but it started with a piano song at the begining, had 3D graphics, and the characters were very simple! When I talked to a old women, she has explained what SOPOUSING was to be a z-buffer (with some crap of course)! Anyway, back to the topic, I have completed Dragon Quest 6 (SNES), translated by NoProgress yesterday, anyone want the save-state? __________________ [sig=416]

April 11th, 2003	#46 (permalink)
Generic Ninja Registered User Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Portugal Posts: 111	Me too _ __________________ [sig=416]

April 14th, 2003	#54 (permalink)
Kane 邪魔ゎ指せない Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Gosport, England Posts: 26,255	Have you used a Kyro chipset based card? If a game isn't specificaly programed for tile based rendering, it can cause some graphical artifacts from what I've seen. __________________ >Site Live< Pop over to my site for help with setting up PSX emulators. Help for the Final Fantasies and other RPGs avalaible Celes: (Desktop) Athlon 64 X2 4200+, 2Gb 400MHz DDR Ram, MSI K8N Platinum, GeForce 8800 GTS 320Mb, 500Gb RAID HDD, Vista Business Erika: (MCPC) Athlon XP 2400+, 1Gb 400MHz DDR Ram, geForce 6800 256Mb, 80Gb Hdd, XP 2005 MCE Kimiko: (Desktop 2) Athlon 64 3000+, 512Mb 400MHz DDR Ram, Asus K8V, geForce 6800 128Mb

April 15th, 2003	#56 (permalink)
Kane 邪魔ゎ指せない Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Gosport, England Posts: 26,255	The PowerVR. Used in the DC. Made some very suck PC cards. __________________ >Site Live< Pop over to my site for help with setting up PSX emulators. Help for the Final Fantasies and other RPGs avalaible Celes: (Desktop) Athlon 64 X2 4200+, 2Gb 400MHz DDR Ram, MSI K8N Platinum, GeForce 8800 GTS 320Mb, 500Gb RAID HDD, Vista Business Erika: (MCPC) Athlon XP 2400+, 1Gb 400MHz DDR Ram, geForce 6800 256Mb, 80Gb Hdd, XP 2005 MCE Kimiko: (Desktop 2) Athlon 64 3000+, 512Mb 400MHz DDR Ram, Asus K8V, geForce 6800 128Mb

April 16th, 2003	#58 (permalink)
Kane 邪魔ゎ指せない Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Gosport, England Posts: 26,255	No, just thier PC implementation of it sucks. __________________ >Site Live< Pop over to my site for help with setting up PSX emulators. Help for the Final Fantasies and other RPGs avalaible Celes: (Desktop) Athlon 64 X2 4200+, 2Gb 400MHz DDR Ram, MSI K8N Platinum, GeForce 8800 GTS 320Mb, 500Gb RAID HDD, Vista Business Erika: (MCPC) Athlon XP 2400+, 1Gb 400MHz DDR Ram, geForce 6800 256Mb, 80Gb Hdd, XP 2005 MCE Kimiko: (Desktop 2) Athlon 64 3000+, 512Mb 400MHz DDR Ram, Asus K8V, geForce 6800 128Mb

April 10th, 2003	#41 (permalink)
finalight Banned Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Singapore Posts: 11	you should set it yourself

April 11th, 2003	#45 (permalink)
finalight Banned Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Singapore Posts: 11	ohh..think I got it

April 11th, 2003	#47 (permalink)
finalight Banned Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Singapore Posts: 11	so does z buffer always work perfectly?

April 14th, 2003	#49 (permalink)
finalight Banned Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Singapore Posts: 11	so what does z buffer require?

April 14th, 2003	#51 (permalink)
finalight Banned Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Singapore Posts: 11	so better graphic card means better z buffer?

April 14th, 2003	#53 (permalink)
finalight Banned Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Singapore Posts: 11	then what's the side effect?

April 15th, 2003	#55 (permalink)
finalight Banned Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Singapore Posts: 11	Sorry, but I don't know what is that...

April 16th, 2003	#57 (permalink)
finalight Banned Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Singapore Posts: 11	so it sux too?

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