Nintendo Wii lies!!

[Raiden01]

back in the day it was called revolution. i watch the press confrence and he said when you look at the graphics you will go WOW! and the graphics and graphics are no where near a WOW! lol

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[The Captain]

Don't we have a Nintendo Revolution/Wii thread already? This should go in there.

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[Raiden01]

sorry lol

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[Mako Eyes]

Originally Posted by Raiden01

back in the day it was called revolution. i watch the press confrence and he said when you look at the graphics you will go WOW! and the graphics and graphics are no where near a WOW! lol

ALL Revolution/Wii tech demos were ran on Gamecubes. What the real Wii is capable of doing in terms of graphics, the public don't really know.

[Samor]

"WOW" is more of an opinion. Maybe Reggie & co still go "WOW" about it while the PS3 crowd would rather go "MEH"

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[KanedA]

heh, not to mention, that it's just upgraded urinal (that's how some ppl call it ) anyone has that smash bros video which shows difference in gfx??

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[Samor]

yes...it's amazing...it's just as much difference as you'd normally get between sequels...oh, and Kirby had the sweetest graphical update of them all ;p

Mind, it doesn't look bad and stuff.... I still like my Dreamcast's gfx too

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[Cid Highwind]

Yup, anything with half decent AA and relatively sharp textures and good enough to put out enough polygons can create pretty pictures on an SD tv. In that respect 3d gaming has made a large leap over the 32/64bit generation, where 3d wasn't really looking good.

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[Samor]

Frankly, the differences graphically between dc, ps2, xbox, cube and wii are relatively minimal... of course, when you put a DC next to a PeeWii, you're gonna see differences there, but I doubt it would be THAT huge. With that, we might also have to take into account that sadly no one knowns what the DC would've really been able to do, had it not been dropped pretty early on. SA2 and Shenmue 2 were nice indications of that...

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[Cid Highwind]

Yu Suzuki claimed it could do twice the stuff shown on Shenmue 1, so I'm curious. Yet I also once heard a statement it was pushing it with Shenmue 2. But with the latter statement you never know what breakthroughs might have been possible in later development states, kinda like how we saw with PS1 and PS2. The smoke effects and particles in Under Defeat are a nice example of it

I don't know if DC would've been able to push as much polygons as others, probably not, and it has a ram bottleneck I think, but in the texture department it can do pretty nice stuff. And the CPU is pretty powerful as well from what I've gathered. There are differences between these 5 consoles, but they are definately all of the same gen and it shows

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[Shin_Mike_God]

well all ive seen about the wii graphics blows, and i dont expect any big difference between not finished gpu or whatever with the final one, so i guess they are betting on the controller.

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[Samor]

Originally Posted by Cid Highwind

Yu Suzuki claimed it could do twice the stuff shown on Shenmue 1, so I'm curious. Yet I also once heard a statement it was pushing it with Shenmue 2. But with the latter statement you never know what breakthroughs might have been possible in later development states, kinda like how we saw with PS1 and PS2. The smoke effects and particles in Under Defeat are a nice example of it

I especially like the effect where you beat the second boss.

I don't know if DC would've been able to push as much polygons as others, probably not, and it has a ram bottleneck I think, but in the texture department it can do pretty nice stuff. And the CPU is pretty powerful as well from what I've gathered. There are differences between these 5 consoles, but they are definately all of the same gen and it shows

Smart use of textures can hide lack of polygons quite well... and the other way round is also possible (especially when aided by huge amounts of "cool" blur effects). DC and PS2, respectively

Originally Posted by Shin_Mike_God

well all ive seen about the wii graphics blows, and i dont expect any big difference between not finished gpu or whatever with the final one, so i guess they are betting on the controller.

Sure they are. but the gfx will be just fine for "old" TV's.

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[Katsuya]

From what I’ve heard the final frontier for Dreamcast graphics was bumpmaping (and better lighting) some of the last games for the system showed off a bit of that. (ETAC) (SA2) (STB2)

[Raiden01]

just watched a thing on ign of the guy playing about 7 wii games and that why i bought it up

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[Samor]

it's basically the same as with the DS. 2D on DS will look better than on GBA, but it's a relatively small difference. The bonus comes in the 3D capabilities, but that falls short compared to a PSP.

Where DS starts to look better than GBA is when 2D games are aided by 3D effects. That tends to work really well. Also, the resolution is quite ideal for 2D sprites.
I was afraid at first that the fact it can do 3D would be another nail in the coffin for 2D gaming, but so far it turns out differently, fortunately.

The other part is that the DS' design and idea brings over games to the West that were never here before, simply because the DS is perfectly suited for them... examples are Another Code, Phoenix Wright and Trauma Center. Those games aren't even that original from a Japanese point of view, because games like that were there for ages, but the DS is better suited for it, which also causes that it's the first time this stuff gets released outside of Japan... that's one of the cooler aspects of the DS, imo. Same with the Wii perhaps.... quirky odd games were already there, but often limited to Japan, and in smaller numbers. Nintendo just tries to make mainstream what already was there.

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[Cid Highwind]

Originally Posted by Katsuya

From what I’ve heard the final frontier for Dreamcast graphics was bumpmaping (and better lighting) some of the last games for the system showed off a bit of that. (ETAC) (SA2) (STB2)

ETAC = eternal arcadia?
and what's STB2?

We had a discussion on dcemulation about those graphics as well, and whether or not it used bumpmapping. Some found that it was just clever use of highly detailed textures rather than bumpmapping. I for one would really like to know what they used in Shenmue 2, some things really look bumpmapped to me. SA2 and Shenmue 2 indeed had impressive lighting, same for F355 Challenge and MSR. Btw, I guess you kinda have to see it to believe it, but Bomberman Online had some of the most amazing effects on the system, some cutscenes made me believe it was prerendered fmv, but never did I hear the cd drive load it, and I think I spotted some very slight hints at it still being rendered directly. I'd wish some more games would've been able to use these effects because some of the blurring effects remind me of high quality motion blur, definately not the simple stuff used in Shenmue 1


And I agree with Samor here, current generation has already brought a lot of nice Japanese games over to the western world: Rez, Samba da Amigo, Seaman, fishing games with rods, guitar games, karaoke games, donkey konga. Also, I don't think Nintendo is the only one trying to make it more popular, Sony has had a fair deal in it as well, with Guitaroo man. Most of the time however, it's Sega and Nintendo creating new ideas, and Sony making it an even larger succes, especially for mature audiences. The way Sega and Nintendo deliver their ideas are usually found kiddy by the western audience, while japanese adults wouldn't mind playing such games.

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[marc_lye]

Originally Posted by Cid Highwind

And I agree with Samor here, current generation has already brought a lot of nice Japanese games over to the western world: Rez, Samba da Amigo, Seaman, fishing games with rods, guitar games, karaoke games, donkey konga. Also, I don't think Nintendo is the only one trying to make it more popular, Sony has had a fair deal in it as well, with Guitaroo man. Most of the time however, it's Sega and Nintendo creating new ideas, and Sony making it an even larger succes, especially for mature audiences. The way Sega and Nintendo deliver their ideas are usually found kiddy by the western audience, while japanese adults wouldn't mind playing such games.

I wish western audiences would wake up and stop acting like so called 'hardcore' or 'mature' gamers because really, they're the most immature audiences in videogaming today. Not touching something because it's Nintendo branded, or because it has bright, almost cartoony like visuals or thinking that some games are for 'kids' are amongst the biggest mistakes the majority of western gamers make. Its that bad attitude that stops publishers and developers from being more brave and giving us original games. Instead we end up with more violence and bad language in our games because they're apparently mature. Don't get me wrong, not all of these games are garbage, I love the GTA series as one of the greatest moments in gaming altogether, but theres no way in hell its a mature series, its one of the most immature games there is.

Hopefully though, with the way Nintendo have caught alot of people's attention with the Wii, the focus on fun, and not graphics, perhaps this just might be the step needed to finally change the attitude of alot of these shallow minded gamers. Besides, for all the graphics whores out there, there are gonna be some visually stunning titles on the Wii. 'Good graphics' shouldnt be about polygons, textures and lighting effects, they should be about unique visual styles, something that many MANY 'good' looking games these days completely lack, opting to go for looking more realistic than the last realistic looking game.

Slightly off topic opinion, but to add a lil weight to what I just said I would like to say that for me: Yoshi's Island on the SNES - One of the most visually stunning games ever made, even today it stands out for it's visual style.

But yeah, going a lil offtopic now hehem

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[firyace]

What is SA2

Plus, The only thing thatt caught my attention in wii is how they used it as a sword or a golf club in one of their demos. You should see how funny it is that they use the controller to play COD3, its just rediculous, I would rather play it with a Guncon.

From what it looks so far, the Wii is quite limited in terms of graphics and playability (since the controller is limited in doin a few things, the rest just look awkward).

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[Cid Highwind]

Originally Posted by marc_lye

I wish western audiences would wake up and stop acting like so called 'hardcore' or 'mature' gamers because really, they're the most immature audiences in videogaming today. Not touching something because it's Nintendo branded, or because it has bright, almost cartoony like visuals or thinking that some games are for 'kids' are amongst the biggest mistakes the majority of western gamers make. Its that bad attitude that stops publishers and developers from being more brave and giving us original games. Instead we end up with more violence and bad language in our games because they're apparently mature. Don't get me wrong, not all of these games are garbage, I love the GTA series as one of the greatest moments in gaming altogether, but theres no way in hell its a mature series, its one of the most immature games there is.

Hopefully though, with the way Nintendo have caught alot of people's attention with the Wii, the focus on fun, and not graphics, perhaps this just might be the step needed to finally change the attitude of alot of these shallow minded gamers. Besides, for all the graphics whores out there, there are gonna be some visually stunning titles on the Wii. 'Good graphics' shouldnt be about polygons, textures and lighting effects, they should be about unique visual styles, something that many MANY 'good' looking games these days completely lack, opting to go for looking more realistic than the last realistic looking game.

Slightly off topic opinion, but to add a lil weight to what I just said I would like to say that for me: Yoshi's Island on the SNES - One of the most visually stunning games ever made, even today it stands out for it's visual style.

But yeah, going a lil offtopic now hehem

I couldn't agree more, style plays a very important role. Btw, I forgot to mention Jet Set Radio, which also didn't sell very well in the western world, but the game did pave the way for many Cell Shaded games. I think there are a lot of people who would rate it as kiddy as well because of the style and gameplay, yet it's one of the most fun, original and better looking games of this generation.

And Yoshi's Island's graphics still stand strong as some of the best 2d graphics ever created.

SA2, Sonic Adventure 2

And I think you might be right firyace, I just hope developers will find good ways that we haven't come up with yet for the controller to shine.

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[Mako Eyes]

Originally Posted by firyace

Plus, The only thing thatt caught my attention in wii is how they used it as a sword or a golf club in one of their demos. You should see how funny it is that they use the controller to play COD3, its just rediculous, I would rather play it with a Guncon.

From what it looks so far, the Wii is quite limited in terms of graphics and playability (since the controller is limited in doin a few things, the rest just look awkward).

Originally Posted by Cid Highwind

And I think you might be right firyace, I just hope developers will find good ways that we haven't come up with yet for the controller to shine.

Yea, a lot of people seem to be bothered by that. I'm no exception. However, they are making games that utilize the Wii Classic controller (or, for those who already have a GC, the GameCube controller.) Smash Bros is the first to do this, so maybe there will be others.