Capcom Arcade Hits - more emulator + ROM gone commercial?

takwu · February 13th, 2004

Lately I've noticed those classic Capcom arcade games for PC and PocketPC on store shelves. No I'm not talking about PC ports like Street Fighter Alpha. It's those older games, like 1942, or Ghosts 'n Goblins, or Street Fighter (the original).

So I searched the net for more info.
Many sites, like CD Access (http://www.cdaccess.com/html/quick/capcom1pj.htm), which sell those Capcom titles advertise that the product uses HanaHo HiVE.
You might know this, but for those who don't, HiVE was a freeware arcade emulator (http://www.sys2064.com/hive.htm) written by Larry Bank (http://www.bitbanksoftware.com/). At some point, Bank had stopped working on the freeware and started working for commercial emulators. Most notable was the Microsoft Arcade Pak for PocketPC, which to this day holds its own against freeware emulators, such as MAMECE3. He later went on to emulate 1942 on PocketPC. However, after that, I never heard other projects by Bank. HanaHo (http://www.hanaho.com), famous for the original HotRod arcade joystick for PC, seemed to have obtained the rights to HiVE.

So now we have Capcom Aracde Hits (also titled Capcom Coin-Op Collection). I have doubts about the sales of these titles, but you never know. The whole idea of commercial emulators is still iffy. But every time it happens, I get the feeling that we are digging out of the underground cavern.

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Last edited by takwu; February 13th, 2004 at 08:32..

l3illyl3ob · February 13th, 2004

none of this is rare. 90% of classic released games are emulated, the rest are remade. nothing from the 16-bit era or beyond are ported anymore, unless if its for the gba. The only thing exceptional about this is that it doesn't happen often for the pc.

takwu · February 16th, 2004

Well, I thought "classic released games" as a whole is rare enough.
I can only think of a few, like Namco Museum for the current consoles, and Midway Arcade Treasures. Both of which seem to be developed in-house.
The significance of these Capcom releases is that 1) it's based on or derived from a freeware emulator HiVE, meaning freeware emulators are being commercially recognized for their values, and 2) it seems that the author of a freeware emulator has successfully gained some practical rewards for his talents, so emulation development can be more than just a hobby.

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cutie · February 16th, 2004

Hi all. The only thing about Midway Arcade Treasures being developed "in house" as you say takwu is that they are the actual arcade games. At least this is what I have been led to believe. The games in these collections are not translations or "ports" as people call them. They are the actual Acade article.
cutie

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takwu · February 16th, 2004

Yes, they are the actual arcade games, but the hardware that runs these games needs to be emulated in software that runs on the consoles.
I was referring to the emulators that seem to be developed in-house. I.e. instead of contracting someone outside the company to develope the emulator, in which case they risk leaking specifications, they just let their regular game developers to make these emulators. I think

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cutie · February 16th, 2004

Hi all. Ah I see what you are getting at takwu and now that you have clarified it for me, I would say that I agree with you. I wonder what type of emulator these game developers use or come up with to run these Arcade roms so well? Perhaps one similar to Mame?
cutie

__________________
I am gone (the picture of me) for now.

takwu · February 17th, 2004

Well the main difference between inoffical and official emulators is that developers for official emulator might get the original specification of the hardware. Without these specifications, the developer would need to reverse engineer the hardware.
That can involve a lot, for example: indentify individual parts of the hardware, figure out how they are connected (the circuit), find public specifications of those parts, then connect the dots. And that's only the simplest case.
With the original specifications, most/all of that can be skipped. Plus, if any part of the reverse engineering isn't perfect, the emulation becomes inaccurate.
Having said that tho, most older hardwares (like the 80's arcade machines) are pretty thoroughly figured out, because they're simple and the public has studied them for so long, or in some cases the original specifications have become public.

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February 13th, 2004	#1 (permalink)
takwu previous extinction Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: BC, Canada Posts: 1,857	Capcom Arcade Hits - more emulator + ROM gone commercial? Lately I've noticed those classic Capcom arcade games for PC and PocketPC on store shelves. No I'm not talking about PC ports like Street Fighter Alpha. It's those older games, like 1942, or Ghosts 'n Goblins, or Street Fighter (the original). So I searched the net for more info. Many sites, like CD Access (http://www.cdaccess.com/html/quick/capcom1pj.htm), which sell those Capcom titles advertise that the product uses HanaHo HiVE. You might know this, but for those who don't, HiVE was a freeware arcade emulator (http://www.sys2064.com/hive.htm) written by Larry Bank (http://www.bitbanksoftware.com/). At some point, Bank had stopped working on the freeware and started working for commercial emulators. Most notable was the Microsoft Arcade Pak for PocketPC, which to this day holds its own against freeware emulators, such as MAMECE3. He later went on to emulate 1942 on PocketPC. However, after that, I never heard other projects by Bank. HanaHo (http://www.hanaho.com), famous for the original HotRod arcade joystick for PC, seemed to have obtained the rights to HiVE. So now we have Capcom Aracde Hits (also titled Capcom Coin-Op Collection). I have doubts about the sales of these titles, but you never know. The whole idea of commercial emulators is still iffy. But every time it happens, I get the feeling that we are digging out of the underground cavern. __________________ Latest toy: Sharp LCD TV Monitor LL-M17W1U Last edited by takwu; February 13th, 2004 at 08:32..

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February 13th, 2004	#2 (permalink)
l3illyl3ob Link to the Underworld Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Detroit Posts: 1,148	none of this is rare. 90% of classic released games are emulated, the rest are remade. nothing from the 16-bit era or beyond are ported anymore, unless if its for the gba. The only thing exceptional about this is that it doesn't happen often for the pc.

February 16th, 2004	#3 (permalink)
takwu previous extinction Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: BC, Canada Posts: 1,857	Well, I thought "classic released games" as a whole is rare enough. I can only think of a few, like Namco Museum for the current consoles, and Midway Arcade Treasures. Both of which seem to be developed in-house. The significance of these Capcom releases is that 1) it's based on or derived from a freeware emulator HiVE, meaning freeware emulators are being commercially recognized for their values, and 2) it seems that the author of a freeware emulator has successfully gained some practical rewards for his talents, so emulation development can be more than just a hobby. __________________ Latest toy: Sharp LCD TV Monitor LL-M17W1U

February 16th, 2004	#4 (permalink)
cutie A new look Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Antelope, California USA Posts: 97	Hi all. The only thing about Midway Arcade Treasures being developed "in house" as you say takwu is that they are the actual arcade games. At least this is what I have been led to believe. The games in these collections are not translations or "ports" as people call them. They are the actual Acade article. cutie __________________ I am gone (the picture of me) for now.

February 16th, 2004	#5 (permalink)
takwu previous extinction Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: BC, Canada Posts: 1,857	Yes, they are the actual arcade games, but the hardware that runs these games needs to be emulated in software that runs on the consoles. I was referring to the emulators that seem to be developed in-house. I.e. instead of contracting someone outside the company to develope the emulator, in which case they risk leaking specifications, they just let their regular game developers to make these emulators. I think __________________ Latest toy: Sharp LCD TV Monitor LL-M17W1U

February 16th, 2004	#6 (permalink)
cutie A new look Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Antelope, California USA Posts: 97	Hi all. Ah I see what you are getting at takwu and now that you have clarified it for me, I would say that I agree with you. I wonder what type of emulator these game developers use or come up with to run these Arcade roms so well? Perhaps one similar to Mame? cutie __________________ I am gone (the picture of me) for now.

February 17th, 2004	#7 (permalink)
takwu previous extinction Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: BC, Canada Posts: 1,857	Well the main difference between inoffical and official emulators is that developers for official emulator might get the original specification of the hardware. Without these specifications, the developer would need to reverse engineer the hardware. That can involve a lot, for example: indentify individual parts of the hardware, figure out how they are connected (the circuit), find public specifications of those parts, then connect the dots. And that's only the simplest case. With the original specifications, most/all of that can be skipped. Plus, if any part of the reverse engineering isn't perfect, the emulation becomes inaccurate. Having said that tho, most older hardwares (like the 80's arcade machines) are pretty thoroughly figured out, because they're simple and the public has studied them for so long, or in some cases the original specifications have become public. __________________ Latest toy: Sharp LCD TV Monitor LL-M17W1U