Sony to reintroduce PS2 BC on the PS3? - Page 2

**Cid Highwind** · July 3rd, 2009

Bleemcast still looks better than this upscaled crap though. Heck, if a Dreamcast can quadruple the PSX resolution, add AA and bilinear filtering, the PS3 does a lousy job by just adding a blur filter.

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DinJerr · July 3rd, 2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by masta.g.86

If they wanted an authentic comparison, both pics would have to be shown at 1:1.

They did. See attachment pics.

Quote:

Originally Posted by masta.g.86

Grrr... Anyway, from what I can see on my own system is that games have fewer "jaggies" but it doesn't become blurry at all. The game is just as "sharp" as when I run it with upscaling turned off. It's akin to running a game in PCSX2 in native and then cranking up the internal resolution.

I don't understand the last part of the sentence. Because the upscaler behaves in a totally different manner. It's more like using Pete's OGL2 plugin, use native internal resolution, hi-res output resolution, then apply HQ2/3X filter to 'smoothen' the jaggies. It is not the same as increasing internal resolution in PCSX2. If you observe the pics below, some edges do get smoothened out properly by the algorithm, while some parts don't. Dante's legs are okay, but the sword seem pretty f-ed up to me.

If the HW emulation on your PS3 produces a different output, please say so because I'd definitely want to get an old PS3 instead of the newer ones next shopping season.

Attached Images

	dmc_noscale.jpg (64.4 KB, 33 views)
	dmc_upscale.jpg (58.6 KB, 35 views)

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Spyhop · July 3rd, 2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by masta.g.86

The game is just as "sharp" as when I run it with upscaling turned off. It's akin to running a game in PCSX2 in native and then cranking up the internal resolution.

Not even close to the same thing. I'm not sure you're understanding the difference between upscaled video output and upscaled rendering.

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masta.g.86 · July 3rd, 2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by DinJerr

They did. See attachment pics.

No, those pics aren't 1:1.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DinJerr

I don't understand the last part of the sentence. Because the upscaler behaves in a totally different manner. It's more like using Pete's OGL2 plugin, use native internal resolution, hi-res output resolution, then apply HQ2/3X filter to 'smoothen' the jaggies. It is not the same as increasing internal resolution in PCSX2. If you observe the pics below, some edges do get smoothened out properly by the algorithm, while some parts don't. Dante's legs are okay, but the sword seem pretty f-ed up to me.

They are the same. In both plugins you can run a game at native resolution while setting your display resolution to something like 1600x1200. The game will not be become less "jaggy" by setting a high display resolution alone. In both cases, you must also increase the internal resolution as well, otherwise, you may as well just run the game with your display resolution matching your internal resolution.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DinJerr

If the HW emulation on your PS3 produces a different output, please say so because I'd definitely want to get an old PS3 instead of the newer ones next shopping season.

This is what I've been saying! It looks sharper on my PS3. I dunno about the SW BC units... Oh yeah, I had to buy mine off Amazon.com. The seller was selling it for $380 shipped while others were selling theirs for $800 or more. The HW BC units are fairly popular and difficult to come by these days.

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Spyhop · July 3rd, 2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by masta.g.86

This is what I've been saying! It looks sharper on my PS3.

Compared to PCSX2? Shens.

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masta.g.86 · July 3rd, 2009

Once again, no. It's sharper than those shoddy screenshots. I've been making the comparison between the screenshots and what I actually see on my PS3.

i.e. screenshots vs. real PS3 not PCSX2 vs. real PS3

From what I see, upscaling turned on looks a lot better than the screenshots suggest, however it doesn't rival the visuals that can be achieved in PCSX2.

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Last edited by masta.g.86; July 3rd, 2009 at 20:53..

Spyhop · July 3rd, 2009

Ah, ok, I misunderstood you then.

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Xblade · July 4th, 2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by PCXL-Fan

yup. All HDTVs have scalers as well, but lower end models probably don't compare to the ps3 upscalers.

just found this ign article on ps3 upscaling.
IGN: PlayStation 3 Upscaling Comparison

It seems to really help with reducing the aliasing. I could see the big benefit with it on large hdtvs

To me the the comparison between ps3 upscaling and pcsx2 is pretty close to the comparison between bluray and 1080p upscaling of DVDs. So PCSX2 is much better looking.

I could have sworn those were ps1 games, those games are hideous.

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Sonic2036

the PS3 needs to be a little more slimer??? the way I see it , its as big as a laptop lol
i remember psp slime was more slimey

V
l

Last edited by Xblade; July 4th, 2009 at 03:16..

Spyhop · July 4th, 2009

could have

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Xblade · July 4th, 2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spyhop

could have

Fixed you grammar nazi.

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Sonic2036

the PS3 needs to be a little more slimer??? the way I see it , its as big as a laptop lol
i remember psp slime was more slimey

V
l

Spyhop · July 4th, 2009

Sorry, the "could of, would of, should of" thing is a pet peeve.

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Squall-Leonhart · July 4th, 2009

> could've <

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runawayprisoner · July 5th, 2009

What about grammar now?

Anyway, Sony took the easy approach and instead of doing "internal" upscaling that involves directly hacking into the executing codes to do stuffs that would otherwise improve the graphics dramatically, they just take the output picture (the completely rendered frame) then... upscale it using a certain pixel filter. I can't tell which it is, but it ain't Bilinear as far as my eyes can tell. At least their filter does a better job than most internal filters in most LCDs. I could tell from playing a PS2 game on a real PS2 versus on my PS3.

If they directly hack into the drawing routines, then there might be interesting results.

Something like PCSX2 for instance.

For now, it's true that Sony isn't doing much to the BC department. Let's see how it's going to play out in the future.

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Spyhop · July 5th, 2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by Squall-Leonhart

> could've <

That's where the "could of" misconception came from, I know. I try not to use the contraction at all anymore though.

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chris-007 · July 5th, 2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by skoreanime

bit-tech.net | Sony to reintroduce PS2 emulation on PS3?

That is bull****. The patent shows nothing new. The EE has been emulated since the early PAL models, GS was hardware. Later they removed all PS2 hardware and compatibility was gone.

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skoreanime · July 5th, 2009

Of course it shows something new.

It's showing Sony themselves may be interested in bringing back BC.

Phil · July 5th, 2009

Hopefully the prices on 60 gb models will lower on ebay

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chris-007 · July 6th, 2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by skoreanime

Of course it shows something new.

It's showing Sony themselves may be interested in bringing back BC.

EE Emulation has been long known. All I saw in the patent were standard emulation methods.

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Squall-Leonhart · July 6th, 2009

>.> all i see is chris *****ing.

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Paratech · July 6th, 2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by Squall-Leonhart

>.> all i see is chris *****ing.

???

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July 3rd, 2009	#21 (permalink)
Cid Highwind Human Metal Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Holland / Hungary Posts: 13,538	Bleemcast still looks better than this upscaled crap though. Heck, if a Dreamcast can quadruple the PSX resolution, add AA and bilinear filtering, the PS3 does a lousy job by just adding a blur filter. __________________ PC Specs: CPU: Intel Q8200 @ 2.8GHz GPU: Sapphire ATi HD4870 / 1024MB / Core: 801 / Mem: 1000 Mobo: Gigabyte EP35-DS3 (rev 2.1) SPU: Creative X-Fi Xtreme Music RAM: 2GB Kingston HyperX DDR2 1066 @ 4-4-4-12 ~ 800MHz HDD: 1TB Samsung Spinpoint, 32MB PSU: Hiper Type-R 580W Monitor: Iiyama B2403WS / 19201200 Geometry Wars: 198.400 Lumines: 999.999 Join the NGEmu Folding @ Home community NOW!*

July 3rd, 2009	#27 (permalink)
Spyhop Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Edmonton Posts: 3,800	Ah, ok, I misunderstood you then. __________________ WINTERFELL - C2D E8400 - DFI Lanparty JR P45-T2RS MATX Motherboard - Mushkin Redline PC2 8000 DDr2 - EVGA Geforce GTX 285 - Silverstone SG01 case RIVERRUN - Pentium DC 2.5ghz - 4GB OCZ DDR2 - Cheapie ASUS Motherboard w/onboard vid - Antec Sonata III KING'S LANDING - 80GB Playstation 3

July 4th, 2009	#29 (permalink)
Spyhop Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Edmonton Posts: 3,800	could have __________________ WINTERFELL - C2D E8400 - DFI Lanparty JR P45-T2RS MATX Motherboard - Mushkin Redline PC2 8000 DDr2 - EVGA Geforce GTX 285 - Silverstone SG01 case RIVERRUN - Pentium DC 2.5ghz - 4GB OCZ DDR2 - Cheapie ASUS Motherboard w/onboard vid - Antec Sonata III KING'S LANDING - 80GB Playstation 3

July 4th, 2009	#31 (permalink)
Spyhop Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Edmonton Posts: 3,800	Sorry, the "could of, would of, should of" thing is a pet peeve. __________________ WINTERFELL - C2D E8400 - DFI Lanparty JR P45-T2RS MATX Motherboard - Mushkin Redline PC2 8000 DDr2 - EVGA Geforce GTX 285 - Silverstone SG01 case RIVERRUN - Pentium DC 2.5ghz - 4GB OCZ DDR2 - Cheapie ASUS Motherboard w/onboard vid - Antec Sonata III KING'S LANDING - 80GB Playstation 3

July 4th, 2009	#32 (permalink)
Squall-Leonhart Behind ur girlfriend :D Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 18,819	> could've < __________________ VBA-M \| Xtemu \| NGOHQ \| Post Impact Productions \| TNHW \| XBCD 0.2.6 \| Satanic666's Emulator Compiles Don't be a NOOB, READ THE NGEmu/EmuForums Rules of Conduct Need Help with ePSXe? This is your first stop!. If you don't post all the required information, you don't get help. Everytime someone posts a romsite, God kills a beautiful woman.

July 5th, 2009	#33 (permalink)
runawayprisoner Mobile Fanatic Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Santa Cruz, CA Posts: 6,198	What about grammar now? Anyway, Sony took the easy approach and instead of doing "internal" upscaling that involves directly hacking into the executing codes to do stuffs that would otherwise improve the graphics dramatically, they just take the output picture (the completely rendered frame) then... upscale it using a certain pixel filter. I can't tell which it is, but it ain't Bilinear as far as my eyes can tell. At least their filter does a better job than most internal filters in most LCDs. I could tell from playing a PS2 game on a real PS2 versus on my PS3. If they directly hack into the drawing routines, then there might be interesting results. Something like PCSX2 for instance. For now, it's true that Sony isn't doing much to the BC department. Let's see how it's going to play out in the future. __________________ cChip interpreter WIP - current status: Release Candidate LRx Filter RC - current performance rating: 9/10

July 5th, 2009	#36 (permalink)
skoreanime Your resident reaper... Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Canada Posts: 6,031	Of course it shows something new. It's showing Sony themselves may be interested in bringing back BC.

July 5th, 2009	#37 (permalink)
Phil Regular User ;) Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Naples Florida Posts: 9,963	Hopefully the prices on 60 gb models will lower on ebay __________________ A Mac is like an escort, you pay a ton and get nothing. A PC is like a hooker, it's a lot cheaper and gives you what you're after.. and if unlucky some diseases as well, that's why you gotta use protection. -CC

July 6th, 2009	#39 (permalink)
Squall-Leonhart Behind ur girlfriend :D Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 18,819	>.> all i see is chris ***ing. __________________ VBA-M \| Xtemu \| NGOHQ \| Post Impact Productions \| TNHW \| XBCD 0.2.6 \| Satanic666's Emulator Compiles Don't be a NOOB, READ THE NGEmu/EmuForums Rules of Conduct Need Help with ePSXe? This is your first stop!.** If you don't post all the required information, you don't get help. Everytime someone posts a romsite, God kills a beautiful woman.