[industrian]

Originally Posted by CKemu

I bring up the 'old chestnut' as many scots I know tend to think that magically they'll remain on the same foothold of the economic and world political ladder and England is going to treat them the same as ever.

We'll never be on par with England financially. Then again Scotland has 5 million people compared to England's 50 million. Scotland however has great "human" resources - scientiific and technical knowledge especially. Our education system is 1st class and history has proven time and time again that we're a very industrious nation. Our economy would take a hit in the short term, but with the relaxation of our exchange rate, you'd see a lot of investment in our readily-available facilities.

Most people I know agree with me that we Scots have got over the demise of the British Empire, and we're more than happy to just sit next to Ireland instead of trying to remain a regional or world power. Scotland has no need for nuclear weapons, submarines, or anything that could make us "big" on the political map. Give us our "wee bit hill and glen" and we'll be happy with it.

Originally Posted by CKemu

Gaelic being wiped out, you'd blame us for that?

I'd prefer to keep words like "us" and "them" out of this. In the Anglo-Scots context we're in it has certain connotations.

About Gaelic: the Highland clearances pretty much destroyed it (as it did to the identity of a lot of Scots.) 50,000-100,000 speak it now though, so it's not dead yet.

Originally Posted by CKemu

I've never heard anyone consider Gaelic a bastardisation of English, nor something gutter trash would speak, perhaps thats just my social circle eh? If you want gutter trash..try Sheffield..init

Scotland has two native languages. Gaelic and Scots. Scots is a distinct language, but due to it's similarities with English it just gets called either Scottish slang, or corrupted English. Whereas Gaelic was used almost exclusively in the Highlands, Scots was universal. When the Act of Union hit, every rich person learnt English so that they could move to England and become even richer. Over time this left just the working classes speaking Scots. This brushed off on the language, and it became "the poor man's language" next to English. Again, over time this became law when the law decreed that it wasn't a language to be used by "educated" people.

Sorry to semi-rant about that, but the fact I've been taught (technically) a foreign language all my life instead of one of two native ones kinda pisses me off. I'd like to be able to speak fluent Scots and to write in that language, but all I know is bits and pieces of it that have survived in regional dialects. And even if I could speak it, the stigma of it is that deep that I'd be automatically assumed to be some ill-educated brute who just crawled out of the River Clyde if I ever decided to use it.

Originally Posted by CKemu

Manage your own affairs? I'm not Scottish so beyond a global scale I wouldn't know your 'at home' affairs, I'd assume education and/with culture are primary concerns for any scot, however I'm a firm believer that modern man needs to unify and resolve these concerns, rather than split up like school kids in a playground, to divide will only encourage hostility and less understanding....your independance will probably come a greater cost than many of Scotlands citizins immediately recognise.

I don't see us losing anything. The SNP are a bunch of European social democrats, so we'll remain in the European Union and all other major international agreements. It's not as if we're becoming North Korea or something. Scotland and England will always remain favourable trading partners, closest allies, and friends whether in union or not.